The Bitcoin Group, the American original, for over the last 10 seconds, the sharpest Satoshi's, the best Bitcoin's, the hardest cryptocurrency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists, Dan Eave, the crypto raptor. Hello, that's Ike Neep's, my back. Victoria Jones from Satoshi's page. On Swami's and me from France. And I'm Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network, moving on to issue one. Issue one. Bitcoin rallies more than 7% as court sides with grayscale over the SEC in crypto ETF case as the SEC as the court said, grayscale's lawsuit against the SEC has been closely watched by investors and the denial of grayscale's proposal was arbitrary and capricious. The commission failed to adequately explain why it approved the listing of two Bitcoin future ETPs, but not grayscale's proposed Bitcoin ETP, the court said in the ruling. In the absence of a coherent explanation, this unlike regulatory treatment of like products is unlawful. We therefore grant grayscale's petition for review and vacate the commission's order. As everyone has said, the likeness of this SEC overturned and this ETF being approved means that other Bitcoin ETFs, including Black Rocks, who's filed in late June, as well as fidelity, wisdom tree, Van Eyck and Invesco, as well as others may be approved. Dan, it may be the season of Bitcoin ETFs. What do you think about the SEC's decision, especially their incredible paragraph that echoes the exact same things that we said on this show? As much as it's long overdue, right? A court case going really in favor of a crypto company and they brought up in the article, the reason they pointed out that the other ETFs got approved and there's where rejected. The whole point of it was about the underlying asset, right? The issues that the SEC had were about Bitcoin that could be manipulated and the price, etc, could be manipulated for exchanges, but then surely the same reasoning happens with a future's contract. It's still, you're still, you know, affected by the underlying asset if there is manipulation going. So the fact that this is swinging in, in Grace Gell's favor, I think it's very positive overall, whether they get their spot ETF before Black Rock. Obviously it's in the, it's in the, it peels right, but there's still a chance that technically, you know, this could drag on and Black Rock ended up getting theirs before Grace Gell. And obviously Grace Gell, it's a, there are more a full on crypto company, whereas obviously Black Rock's been around for years and, and I would hate for it to play into the, into the, the hands of, you know, the existing financial infrastructure that gets their first, rather than, you know, actually awarding the first Bitcoin spot ETF to an actual crypto Bitcoin company. So ultimately, I think it's, it's good. Obviously there's people that still think that ETFs and spot ETFs are particularly a bad for Bitcoin, but it allows people to get exposure and we said this before once they get exposure to Bitcoin, they would much rather, actually learn about Bitcoin and then hopefully end up holding their own, if they entrust themselves holding their own destiny with their own private keys. So overall, really positive, although the games that they're talking about in that article have been kind of paired off. So over what we know the last seven days, we're up like 0.19%. We're not going down, 0.18, I should have said that slightly quicker. So, you know, it did pump say 7% or something, but it's gone straight back down. Whether this is going to be a whole, a puncture hole in the armor of the SEC in general, and there are other court cases against, you know, coin base against Bittreks against Binance. And whether they're perhaps misusing their, their power to pick on cryptocurrency companies. That, you know, that's remains an open book at the moment. I'd like to see more decisions going against the SEC because they seem to be a bit overbearing recently. And as we said Gary, you know, Gensler's now, he's hot on AI and says that crypto is not even a thing, you know, Bitcoin's not even worth thinking about right now. So that's going to give Bitcoin and crypto companies a bit more breeding space. So I positive I've roll. Dan, I think you're right. I think that gray scale might win the court case, but BlackRock will get the ETF first or gray scale could be approved. And then a week later or two weeks later, suddenly BlackRock enters the scene. It does seem like every way is being cleared for their entry. And one has said that, you know, this is the company. This is the massive force that will not be stopped. And it's great to see the SEC be ruled against here by the judge by the court. I definitely appreciated the paragraph where they said it was capricious. And they said they didn't even understand their ruling or their logic for treating these like projects in an unlike way. As we've said before, having the futures ETFs, but not having the spot ETF not only did it not make sense from an equality perspective, it also seems like they were specifically citing against Bitcoin, allowing people to bet against Bitcoin with a futures market, but not to bet for Bitcoin with a spot market. And it does look like that's finally going to be solved. Victoria Jones, what do you think about the ETF decision by the court and the likelihood of other future ETFs? Yeah, I think that stuck between a bit of a bit like a rock and a hard place, aren't they really because, you know, the thing about Bitcoin is it's an asset they've never had to deal with before. You all know it's been designed to be a disruptor of the existing financial system. And you know, the people who organize organize the financial system understand this and so they understand the danger of a spot ETF. The future ETF is different because you're not having to. But the fact that coin. And so I think they're doing the best they can to resist it as much as possible, but you know, we're in the then fight you stay and they're going to lose this battle and we all knew lose this battle because the game theory is completely stacked against them. This completely disrupts the whole financial system and, you know, a spot ETF is very would be very dangerous to the rest of the financial system due to the limited supply and the fact that people can keep it in their own possession, you know, unlike a gold ETF. And so it's not worth it because gold is managed by the bank. People very rarely held it in their own possession, but of course that's not the case with Bitcoin. So, you know, it's very interesting the way this is going to play out. Obviously, you know, the courts hand the tide, you know, once they make a ruling like this, then, you know, if it's unfair to not allow the most spot ETF when they've already got future ZTF, then it's going to be unfair to stop other people having a spot ETF and. Yeah, the next few months could be very interesting. I do think you're right. I think the other ETFs will be approved and they have little choice now given the simplicity of the ruling and the ridiculousness of what they had previously held against the companies. I do think that we'll see these ETFs and I saw some kind of meme on the internet. I think it was Andreas or something and they were talking about Bitcoin and they're like, of course it will be valuable. This is the world's first and it was like all these different words together. It was like decentralized, you know, internet money, no middleman, like all these different things and you can understand how the regulators have no way of understanding this. They've never seen anything like this before a true Swiss army knife of possibilities. And if they allow it to get through if they allow it to get into their systems as we said many times before about the Trojan horse, they'll never get it out. We've already seen as they're trying to develop these CBDCs, it's because they see the value of Bitcoin, the value of having a asset that they can send around that isn't controlled by anyone that operates 24 7 365 a heck of a lot faster than the old swift system and other systems that they're using. To send money around, especially the systems of the Federal Reserve users to supply the various banks moving on to the exit question. Dan, Eve, do you think this is it? Are we about to see all the Bitcoin ETFs that we could ever want approved? Yeah, I think the US is finally going to follow suit Europe agreed there their first star was in the Jacobi ETF in the first European spot, Bitcoin ETF. So, you know, I think the US markets need they need the US people need access to Bitcoin, the normies via their 401k and all that stuff. So I think yeah. Flood is coming racial cells for the flood. Victoria, Victoria Jones, is it time for the Bitcoin ETF madness? It looks like it. I don't think the, you know, the first hole in the dam has been broken. You know, it's all downhill from here. I have to be interesting to see. Excellent. Moving on to issue two. Why does zoom hide the screen share button issue two X IE Twitter and this funny because the company is even called Twitter payments X payments just sounds dirty. Obtains a license to store transfer and trade Bitcoin and crypto. Yes, we've talked about it before Elon Musk and his incredible dreams for X dot com, the internet's bank merged with PayPal, and now he's back again and he's bought Twitter mainly just to get the eyeballs mainly just to get the network effect. But now he's saying that they might transfer store and trade Bitcoin and crypto. Victoria Jones, what do you think about X dot com and their ambitions to become the everything app? Well, I think anyone who's been following the story with Twitter is not a tall surprise. We all know that he holds Bitcoin on the balance sheet of his companies. He's again, he's one of the big holders, along with Michael Seder. He's not been as vocal about promoting Bitcoin and some of the others. I mean, he's much more vocal about dogecoin. So, and you know, at one point he was indicating to all his followers that the payment network he would use and make dogecoin, but anyone who understands that technology realises that that makes no sense. So, you know, if you want to be something that's connected into the rest of the global network, you have to use something that the rest of the global network recognizes money. So, you know, Bitcoin makes perfect sense. You know, why wouldn't you really? I mean, I think the thing I observe about Elon Musk is he just likes to create a sensation time to time. Through people for a loop and point them in a different direction. I think he just likes to test his audience, but you know, if you're thinking person, you kind of go, yeah, that's not going to work. So, yeah, I think he's just done that again. It doesn't surprise me at all, but that he's ended up with Bitcoin. I think all of us knew that that was the most likely answer at the end of the day. Dan Eve, we've wanted Twitter to be a Bitcoin wallet for a long time, whether it was with tipping and apps like Change Tip or perhaps the Lightning Network being integrated into Twitter. And of course, like Victoria says, Elon's ridiculous love for Dogecoin, which would be funny if it didn't cause so many people to lose money. What do you think Dan about his new plans for X.com and Bitcoin and crypto wallets? Well, it was kind of inevitable that the twin was kind of leaning on that that sort of pathway, right? You know, Jack, obviously being quite a big Bitcoin connoisseur had done some some you know some groundwork into it at least and probably put the thought into into Elon's head right about the fact that he could be using it as a payments network. And as you said, you know, buying something with it that's already got a network effect is going to help you roll out your amazing all in one app, whoever you are. So for him, it seems like a logical logical purchase, whether he does something crazy and makes Dogecoin that the tipping sort of network or whatever. Obviously, I think I'd like to see lightning. Maybe he'll try a world, not what is it, world coin. Yeah, the old, you know, chat GPT and make his own token or something like that, although I hope not. I think. You know, the likelihood that he will use like lightning on Dogecoin is probably more likely than him making a token to be honest, but I wouldn't put it past him as you know the whole Samultman and the world coin completely came out of the blue and it just made me think that it just made me think how tacky. You know, chat GPT suddenly gone not chat GPT, but the fact that they're doing, you know, the guy who behind chat GPT made a token, I mean, it just seems so tacky. But yeah, this is going to get the normies in right. This has got half a half a billion users. I'm sure a lot of them don't use the vast majority don't use cryptocurrency in any way. So this is a good way for for onboarding, you know, significant portion of the of the planet via an app that they already use. Day in day out. Yeah, just hope it's it's not something crazy like a token and it will be its actual own, you know, usage of lightning network rather than, you know, token or Dogecoin or something. Dogecoin would be great. They could even use a backup database and not actually use Dogecoin in the classic change tip style or Dan has a good point. X X coin X dot coin. I don't know people need to keep an eye out for this. Elon could create his own currency. What a great with a that would be to earn money and raise funds. Moving on to the exit question. Will X dot coms everything app work. Do you want and everything app of Victoria Jones joining us by audio. Will it work? Sorry, Mr. Question, so again. Will Elon Musk's everything app work. Would you use it? Do you want to use the everything app? I think it's difficult to tell really until you actually see what he's produced. There are lots of other people working on a similar kind of concept. Obviously, you've got no star, which, you know, people can already use as a form of exchanging payments. I know it's still a sense. See in this time. It's trying to be developed. And so, you know, a lot of Bitcoin was already working on that kind of technology. So, um, it's difficult to say. I mean, he needs to get a skates on really. Obviously, he, he would have been at a position when Jack Dorsey still into Twitter with, you know, a lot of capital in the company to, uh, to invest in it. But of course, you know, Elon's struggling a little bit because, um, he's not in the same position. He spent a lot of buying Twitter. He's still got Tesla to look after most of his businesses are operating from a big debt position. I understand rather than a big cash position. So, a lot depends on how I think he wants to invest in this. But yeah, he's a little bit behind the curve. Other people, I think, already worked on similar concepts. And, you know, obviously he's, he's working with Twitter, which already has a fairly good reputation. But a bit of that's been damaged. If he can sustain that, then, you know, maybe you'll have a good product. But, yeah, I'd say he's not the first person to have these ideas. A lot depends on how he delivers them, really. It's amazing how Musk has damaged Twitter, his own reputation, and more importantly, his $40 billion investment with these obvious mistakes like getting involved in politics, allowing more hate speech on the platform, firing all of the moderators, and now his new plan to remove the block button, which right now, if someone comes on your post and starts writing negative things, you can block them. Now they can no longer write negative things. That your audience might see when they try to reply to you. If he successfully removes the block button, you won't be able to stop these people writing negative things, essentially griefing your post. And it's just going to lead to more destruction on Twitter, more chaos, more hate speech, less advertisers, less money for the company, and that money could be used to write and program this everything app. As Victoria said, other companies like Facebook and Snapchat are on their way towards an everything app, and they're not going to have these problems, which Elon Musk seems entirely self-inflicted. He's shot himself in the foot here many times, and I don't know why Dan Eve, what do you think? Would you use the everything app and do you think Elon Musk is on his way to making one? Well, he's definitely on his way, you know, he seems like his goal right, he said that flat out, he wants the kind of everything app. Not sure I wouldn't use the kind of crypto functions because I prefer holding my own keys, unless Twitter might still wouldn't use it anyway, but unless they provide the option right to have it up here to be a non-costodial wallet, but I don't see it going that way. It seems like it could go the weach out way, which would be really bad, especially if that gives the government more control over, yeah, over people's money essentially, you know, go about down that social credit route, right, you know, you've said something, you said something, you said something mean to someone on Twitter, so your credits are being taken away, you can't spend your money now and get your loaf of bread. But I think at the same time is there's been a lot of drama, obviously over over him with Twitter, but it very much seems down the political lines of how well you think he's a house well twitters actually doing obviously for creators, it seems like he's opened up quite a new opportunity for them where they weren't being paid on Twitter and then they're now able to get cash in on that. So he's from the creators perspective, he's managed to make them quite happy and it sounds like he's trying to kind of beat the YouTube white rates as well. And so the one thing that I think is actually quite cool is that allowing longer videos, but he's definitely rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way and actually if he'd have done that things a bit more diplomatically rather than kind of arrogance, so kind of quite arrogantly going around things, you know, like bowling in there with the people who are watching the video. And then he's like, I'm not sure if he's a toilet and stuff like that, you know, not some people thought it was funny, but you know he pissed off a lot of people that are Twitter users since 2010 and prior so he could have just tackled it slightly differently and then had both people on his side, but he did go down the political route he rubbed up a lot of people the wrong way, ruffled a lot of feathers. I'm surprised he even got a license because he doesn't really have a favorable reputation in like you know Congress at the moment right there's there there and then the EU that they've sent various warnings saying all these Twitter platforms and hey, hey speech you've got a control it, you know, because because otherwise will come down like a ton of bricks so he's obviously not going around that the right way you'd expect him to be a bit more diplomatic along those lines but we'll see if he's laying his beds and sleeping in it. There's even a concern that if you remove the block button from Twitter that he could be removed from the Google Play Store or the Apple App Store because there's no way to block hate speech. So I agree Dan is in quite a lot of trouble it's mostly self inflicted i'm not sure why he's doing it once again I would refer everyone I don't have the link handy, but I would ask you to read that fantastic article from a few weeks ago talking about x.com and comparing it to we chat the very popular Chinese app. The Chinese app developed first through networking and messaging so it's similar to Twitter but it was more about personal messaging and it was the kind of thing that the Chinese couldn't quit. Grandma anti their cousin everyone was on we chat so they couldn't quit then we chat added in the shopping function the wallet function and of course the Chinese government supported this as a potential ease dropping and social credit type function as well. But if you look at it all of these things came together and everyone became locked into this app but it was because of the network effect of messaging. Twitter sending these short messages getting updates and other information from famous people or museums or weather services are these kind of things. I don't think it's quite the same I don't think it has the same stickiness as messaging and I think he's going to have a hard time building the everything up especially in a variety to very environment like the u.s. or Europe where they aren't so much locked into one app. As the Chinese are I think it was kind of a unique situation that created we chat and he doesn't quite have those forces moving around x.com but we'll see what happens. Moving on check out worldcrypto network.com where on this day August 31st 2014 mad potcoins had a tribute to how finney. In 2015 transmission 46 with the old goodman talked about bitcoin xt art and memes and reddit. In 2016 future rant and Gabriel divine interviewed vende Gupta talking about cipher punks in 2017 we had it today in bitcoin episode talking about gas stations that should accept bitcoin and it's still true to this day. In 2018 anti Hoffman had an interview with Michael Krueger on his one on one show in 2019 we had bitcoin talk show live and now here we are in 2023. Check out these videos and more on worldcrypto network.com. Moving on to issue three issue three Robin Hoods crypto wallet ads bitcoin and doze coin. The company is also beginning to roll out a theorem swaps. Robin Hood whose wallet had previously featured mostly ethereum type options such as ERC 20 tokens and others can now send and receive bitcoin and doze for some reason. It's six month year old wallet has hundreds of thousands of users spread across 140 countries. Victoria Jones what do you think about Robin Hood adding bitcoin and doze for some reason. I didn't know they didn't have them on there. I mean I've not used Robin Hood but some you know it makes logical sense that you know they add all the assets that are available onto their platform. I mean the thing is I think we're an interesting point in crypto development where you know there are a lot of projects that some people are scaring of and some people are very enthusiastic about. Obviously you know where we believe that it's all going to converge on bitcoin but the rest of the world haven't figured that out yet and in order to figure it out I suppose they need access to some of these tokens in order to try it out. I mean it's again it's all part of the evolution of the whole system so yeah I mean I'm surprised I didn't have them on already but you know now they do and let the games begin. Well I do think for some clarification that Robin Hood was allowing you to trade bitcoin and doze coin but now they're allowing you to presumably send and receive to act as a wallet which hilariously coin base was so upset about years ago. Like coin bases not a wallet don't use coin base as a wallet and now just as Robin Hood has a wallet program coin base keeps advertising to me about the coin base wallet program that I could go check out Dan Eve what do you think about Robin Hood the stock market trading app adding bitcoin and doze coin to their wallet. It's kind of about time yeah I knew that you could trade on it wasn't aware that you couldn't but you know set send bitcoin and doze coin and but you could ethereum and ethereum tokens which seems pretty crazy right. The fact that they make an app especially a big mainstream app that wasn't you know a non crypto start start actual company adds ethereum before it adds bitcoin just seems very strange through backwards but at least they're adding it now the fact that they added doze coin I mean. Love it all hey it's it's quite funny I mean I don't have any any any doze coin sadly because what it's a no it's been quite stable right doze coin's been like the stable the stable coin probably more than than the dollar at the moment that it's still floating around like 6.7 cents or something so maybe the fact that it's kind of it's a bit less volatile obviously it's down from its huge peak of life. It's like 80 cents but maybe because of the fact that it's less volatile they're sort of adding it now and it's one of those coins that love it or hate it it's going to be around for a long while like doze coin as much as you can you be a maximalist but in the bottom of the bottom of your heart even though you absolutely hate the others doze coin like coin and ethereum are going to be there for the for the long call. And maybe so is say bitcoin cash is that's why they they it's been added to the the fidelity exchange that they're building right the ESX they they chose bitcoin cash. So it's still obviously in in some people's heart stoze coin but at least people can actually send and receive bitcoin now but obviously better just keep your own coins right by them from an exchange and then transfer them to your own wallet for safety. It's not that I have something against doze coin I just wish they had spent the time they used engineering that to add the lightning network which is an actual payments network an actual technology project more than just kind of a one off joke with the doze on it and it just seems sad that they continuously are pulling people through the mud to support this project to lose their money and then to disappoint them with bad technology. You can't just copy a coin put a doze on it like it was designed as a joke it remains a joke I think the Robin Hood and other companies just want to make money off the fees they just want to fleece your doges they want to take advantage of it so you know you can be mad at me you can be mad at them but I don't think the doze would want you to be mad he would want you to be glad and much happy I think the dozes passed away recently so sad sad farewell to the original. But obviously the meme will live on moving on to issue four issue four green Bitcoin mining nodal power secures 13 million dollars for landfill gas conversion the Utah based a nodal power which specializes in turning landfill gas into energy for power and Bitcoin mining hubs recently announced a successful 13 million dollar seed round backed by strategic investors Brian Black the nodal CEO of the United States. The video stress the technologies potential to make a significant impact on local energy markets. Dan Eve what do you think about nodal power actually using landfill gas and other waste products to create energy to mine Bitcoin again is it's being is being resource for around power sources and if you've got this gas that's going to be escaping that that is a which gas is but I'm seeing this. It's probably like methane right and if that's going to be just leaking out into the atmosphere why not trap it and use it to actually do something. Which is mind Bitcoin so all these projects are really really cool we've seen a lot of them recently like home projects with people what and for a long while heating their houses and heating their swimming pools these are really cool kind of concepts that are they're all making their rounds at the moment so. As a humanity kind of progresses we we see these different ways that we can trap the waste of something and turn it into something else you know like a real fishing factory doesn't have any any waste at all they'll use that waste to produce another product in some way even if it's not related to the thing that it's actually producing. And we're seeing that with with energy especially now that energy can be monetized so easily you know years ago you could only pretty much sell your power back to the to the grid you know be difficult to actually sell your power independently to. To small companies or whatever if you're just like a you know guy with a waterfall thing but now you can mine Bitcoin with it if you've got you know a river flowing for your backyard you can make. You can get power off that and might empower Bitcoin minor so I like I really like the resourcefulness that's coming out and it's also flying in the face of this. This whole thing of Bitcoin only boils the ocean yeah it uses a lot of excess energy but it also promotes a lot of resourcefulness and and innovation in terms of power generation and capturing. Sources of fuel energy fuel that can be turned into energy and then mining Bitcoin. It is interesting Dan perhaps the Americans will become finally like the Native Americans who famously used every part of the Buffalo will start to use the methane and everything else it says in the article. That the methane is produced from gas emissions from landfills and it uses that energy for mining they combust the method typically flared or vented with a generator the resulting electricity is then provided to local utilities and Bitcoin mining operations so it is a fascinating. The way they do it is that they do it is a very interesting operation that they do to get the methane from the landfills using garbage to generate power and energy amazing just like back to the future of Victoria Jones what do you think about the methane mining technology and that they're using it for Bitcoin. I mean I've never really understood the big cost people make about the whole issue of Bitcoin requiring a lot of energy because the most logical argument to my way of thinking is well surely that's just going to incentivize more efficient ways of creating energy and you know there are a lot of people who argue that you know not having a good energy sources one of the few things that holds back or allows progressive humanity. And so you know what better way to incentivize creating new forms of energy I mean that's the most logical conclusion that I can kind of think of and this is just another example of it so yeah you know great great idea whatever it takes you know make use of make find a way to make it useful and you know Bitcoin seems to surprise us over and over again with the different ways in which it's coming up with that. And I hope gradually these arguments about the Bitcoin requiring too many energy sources will eventually be overcome by all of the new innovations that will actually come about as a fact that Bitcoin requires a lot of energy and in the process you know who knows someone create could create an amazing new innovation for creating energy which would benefit us in all sorts of other ways so yeah I'm looking forward to seeing what comes of it. In some ways Bitcoin reminds me of that old show wacky races where all the race cars are going in different directions but like you say they're all trying to find unused power they're trying to find new ways to get methane out of the garbage or to get free electricity from the Russian government or whatever the truth may be to try to you know get those extra sats and to mine them for cheaper it's just a quest to get that golden egg so many people see it. And they're like if only I had power and energy I could mine Bitcoin and they'll do anything anything to mine. Moving on to issue five issue five Bitcoin's most loyal holders continue accumulation despite price low long term holders continue to accumulate Bitcoin with 40% unmoved in more than three years and all time high for that metric Victoria Jones what do you think the big. The coiners are holding on to Bitcoin despite the 50% or more price drop and the recent 10% price drop what do you think this means for the future of Bitcoin and of course it's everyone's asking at home the price the price the price. Yeah doesn't surprise me at all I think really it's probably highly correlated to those to fully understand what Bitcoin is and what it achieves and of course we're still in the early days of that it's a difficult thing to understand you need to understand many different subjects to truly get it. Even those who do get it often had to spend quite a long time studying it before they fully understood and I think the ones that do fully understand they're like i'm not giving this up for anything and the more people that understand the more the network grows and the more the more people hold on to it. The other thing I remember from that article is that there seem to be a lot of people starting to make leverage bets to the downside which I always think is a bit of a contrarian indicator to it then popping to the upside so you know that seems to be that seems to be healthy on the horizon although I have do notice today that the after the recent pump the the prices climbed down again so who knows I mean the thing is we're in a stage of. Bitcoin's price cycle that's notoriously quiet there is there isn't that much news in terms of the price cycle and so even a little blip up and down you know creates a talking point but you know as we know anyone who's been around long enough knows this is a notoriously quite period and so yeah we just hold on and get on with the rest of our lives because you know four years is quite a long time really in terms of a whole life cycle if you just spend your life waiting for the next time Bitcoin has. You know you're going to miss most of your life so most people are just kind of getting on with it stacking stats and you know just waiting for the next phase really. When we can report although this isn't financial advice if you read to the end of the coin desk article it says data even suggests that crypto futures and option traders are positioning for a bearish market in the coming months with Bitcoin prices expected to reach as low as $22,000 or more than a 15% drop from current levels Dan what do you think about the news that the holdlers are holding harder than ever before but there could be even another 15% drop. Yeah it makes perfect sense I caught up with a few friends earlier on this year who I finally convinced to get into to Bitcoin and they they kind of said and these are kind of in you know generally investors why they like the stock market they're happy with with with shares you know tanking after like a pad earnings result whatever but with Bitcoin moving 20% it freaks them out. And so they like pulled out their position I'm like man you just you know you just need a hold for that little bit longer if you don't need the worst thing is they didn't even need the money like their wealthy people so it's really it's it's really quite surprised by them because you know the whole thing when I've been talking about is is as much as Bitcoin is has gone incredibly. Experten had exponential growth in terms of price it's still a long term asset it's not something that you can just buy and expect it's going to be 50% of the next week you know that I think those get days are kind of gone now unfortunately the Bitcoin's becoming less less volatile as Victoria's ever been kind of inside line side side side line territory not sideline flat lining territory right you know the volatility is four year low. But people can't get it especially the new people come into Bitcoin they can't get into their head that it is a you know a lot of jump in without learning about the context of Bitcoin and about inflation and and and that side of the management policies and they jump in thinking about this quick game and that's when they don't get that and they I think I see a bit of a pattern of people not gaining on Bitcoin. Pulling out and then going right I'm going to try something like I don't know flappy coin because I need to make up my losses from Bitcoin and so be interesting to find out how many of those who have sold their Bitcoin actually moved on to other currencies to try and you know almost like a casino right making back your losses you're like oh I've lost a bunch on on roulette maybe I'll be lucky on this this slot machine I can make some money back. And so it obviously moves back and forth between hands that the long term wallets are the ones that still accumulate they know for well that there's there's an accumulation phase before before the harvining we're still you know somewhere six seven seven months away now so it's really not far as all. And whilst I did like earlier on in the year think oh you know maybe we could have a drop to like the sort of 12k level and I you know I can't see that ever happening now and even dropping to 22k just seems a bit tough it seems far fetch now we're certainly we're too close to the harvining right with all these spot easy F's it's different this time right it's different they said. Oh if it did drop to 22k my first thought was I'd buy that so if everyone else had that same thought it would drive right back up and it would be 22k for maybe a few hours I would say Dan it's a little better for going sideways rather than flat lining flat lines what's happened when you die and your heartbeat starts stops beeping so hopefully the Bitcoin isn't flat lining but we'll see how it goes. Let's move on to the exit question will the price of Bitcoin be higher this time next week Victoria Jones keep in mind that you're competing against the online Bitcoin magic eight ball the source of all truth and knowledge. Yeah I'm starting to think at some point it's really going to start picking up pace so I'm going to go with higher. Dan Eve higher or lower. Well I maybe I'm on a streak because I think I said higher last week and it's 0.38% up on the last seven days so I'm going to go for up again just because I'd like to see some green. Up again last week I think the ball predicted up it was a very surprising prediction when against a lot of people's thoughts but that's the way the magic eight ball goes you know it has a mind of its own it doesn't care about your triangles. Here we go ask the magic eight ball will the Bitcoin price be higher this time next week outlook not so good outlook not so good the ball has spoken not so good you can't always get what you want but sometimes if you try you can get what you need right let's move on to predictions or story of the week I'll give Dan a chance to think of his story of the week and I'll talk about my story of the week which is I tried out an interesting new. AI program called opus clip I wish I had the website here open to talk about it but opus clip created 30 different clips from last week show with no instruction at all it created the clips completely randomly then I uploaded the clips into YouTube shorts and I just wanted to see what would happen. It was a very interesting result there were about 30 different clips one of them got 2.9 thousand views another one got 1.7 thousand this is all with no promotion no Twitter links or anything like that and most of them are pretty much ridiculous a lot of them focus on Dan and I talking here about sbs desire for vegan food in prison my joke about potatoes not being vegan. Which is a bit of a joke it's also a bit of a reality when people start adding things like sour cream or bacon bits or cheese to their potatoes or butter which is pretty often they become not vegan so it's a bit of a thing but it's also just a non-sequator right a random funny joke at the time the way the computer recut it doesn't land very well but it's very interesting we got a lot of comments we got a lot of feedback I might try to focus the computer to create a lot of things that I'm not going to do. I'm going to try to create better clips next week and also put text on top of the clips highlighting important words and colors and you guys can try this software for free opus clip I think it was called opus a i something like that and of course if you want to use it more you have to pay the money so I have to look into that but it's a very interesting idea to try to use the YouTube shorts maybe even to promote people to subscribe to this show and to watch this show but for now I think that it's a bit of a joke. I'm just watching really weird 30 second clips of us talking Dan Eve did you get to see any of the clips what do you think I did yeah so I saw the vegan one I was like that's quite that's quite cool so this this app did it automatically did it just chop the mind. Yeah did the whole thing it chopped up the clips it put the words on the screen highlighted the colors took a while but again as far as a human being I didn't really interact with it very much at all I just said hey here's a YouTube video clip it up. That is cool yes it's had some some good feedback well look some of the comments so that's yeah well welcome little addition to the WCN portfolio library library. Oh we'll have to see maybe we'll try it for a couple months we'll see what the subscription options are Dan either you ready with the prediction or a story of the week go ahead. Oh blind me yeah I still didn't I was too busy thinking about about clips shorts shorts but but wearing shorts not YouTube shorts because I'm running out of shorts anyway please no that's the anything I've got is fleas news of the week dogs have got fleas it's non crypt overlaid like shit coins you can't get rid of them though they initially you can you can wash everything fumigate everything smoke bombs and god damn it they they still come back so it's. By daily what like wash twice a. So flea pills fumigating stuff it's crazy yeah so it's a war zone here it's literally a what a flea war zone so yeah good luck to anyone else he's got fleas not I don't have fleas but as in the dogs so I probably have fleas now to be. It sounds like you're doing all the stuff they suggest and I know we get the like either the little pills for the dog that makes the fleas go off of them but much like you say they're still in the environment they're in your carpet they're in your lawn they're in the dirt they're all over the place and even if you do give them the flea pill sometimes they come back with fleas in a couple weeks just the same. Let's go to Victoria Jones do you have a prediction or a story of the week go ahead. Well first of all I just like to say yeah I've seen the little clips I think they're very good actually I think you know when our conversations are often averaging about an hour long I think it's a good way of kind of giving people giving people just to sniff it to what the conversation is it might draw the mid and encourage them to watch the long conversation so yeah I thought they were great as soon as I saw mother we have proof. So I thought that was great story of the week well I've been in France for two weeks so there's not been much related going on with me but on my website before I left my updated the latest newsletter which is about Bitcoin and what's it called the kind of remember the name when newsletter yes it's about the the self-sale bubble so extending on the idea of how fractional. I was a banking began with Bank of England I've then gone on to talk about how that introduction then led to share trading and the scandal that was a salsy bubble so I found that quite interesting to write and I'm sure a few people will find that interesting to read so yeah if you go to my website site citatos page.com Bitcoin and the salsy bubble that's worth a few minutes of your time just to figure that out and if you want to be updated with my other new news letters then in the future then by all means. There's a place to sign up at the bottom where you can be notified when the next thing comes out probably end of September for the next one. Very cool Victoria sounds like a great article always fun to read about the salsy bubble and especially the horrible troubles that Isaac Newton had I can always remember the chart it's a popular internet meme in my Bitcoin adult mind but it's something like Newton invests the price goes out. Newton sells very happy Newton's friends become billionaires Newton is unhappy reinvest price goes down Newton is very unhappy price goes down all the way Newton loses all his money lives in poverty forever it's a tragic story but at the time they didn't know about bubbles they didn't know that things could go up and come back down and have irrational value for a short amount of time it was really one of the first. A bubble so it's quite interesting historical event but we're also the also yeah I mean especially when you relate it's Bitcoin and all the discussions because of course the tulip bubble happened before the salsy bubble but again the history connected with that is very interesting it's worth people who interested in Bitcoin learning about that sorry carry on. It definitely is and the tulip bubble is also very fast bubble and interestingly enough I was just going to say that I'm an Amsterdam this week we're heading up towards the end of the mad tour I'm going to spend a little bit of time here in Amsterdam then I'm heading to London and then I'm flying home to Las Vegas so we'll probably do about one more week of these Thursday shows then we'll go back to Friday shows and try to schedule guests again and again to a more regular schedule as albeit. As albeit home again so thanks to everybody for dealing us out with us out here on the road on a different day thanks to Victoria for joining us from France by iPod our iPad and radio and all the different things shout out to Ben Arck he's on his way to the honey badger conference in Riga Latvia it's a great conference shout out to anybody that's going there I hope you guys have a great weekend at honey badger conference and keep your eyes out for perilini polis coming up. In the next few weeks in Prague HCP if you guys can make it down there another great Bitcoin privacy computer software hacking conference a great place to go a great crew to hang out with down there so thanks to everybody for joining us be sure to give us a thumbs up down below and subscribe add us a comment go check out those crazy YouTube shorts we'll try to work with the AI to make them better this week and see if we can subscribe to that or send us some money or something so thanks so much for joining us until next time bye bye