you the Bitcoin group the American original for over the last 10 seconds the sharpest Satoshi's the best Bitcoin's the hardest crypto currency talk we'd like to welcome our panelists Dan Eave the crypto Raptor was so was so was so Josh Shagala from Valtoro. Good evening ladies and gentlemen. And I'm Thomas Hunt from the world crypto network moving on to issue one issue one Bitcoin uses more electricity than many countries. How is that possible? Says the New York Times once again the idea of energy is number one instead of talking about it really I think we should read this tweet from Michael Del Castillo Michael says I'm so tired of what feels like either willful ignorance or a concerted effort to make Bitcoin's energy use worse than it is. This is the new Bitcoin is for criminals argument. The energy consumption is bad but fixable and mistakes like this feel like a play for clicks. This is after Jeff Roberts tweeted a glaring error in the New York Times yes the New York Times on Bitcoin energy use the article suggests that every coin base transaction must be validated on the Bitcoin network and use energy not as not true as most coin base transactions are cleared internally and have been for like the last 10 years here we are again Bitcoin is bad it destroys energy if you use multiplication it could destroy the entire world Dan Eve your thoughts on Bitcoin and the incredible energy consumption. Yeah it's definitely the energy things definitely the the kind of fad of the fad of the year right or fad of the the last few years obviously energy energy usage and environmentalism is quite a big thing obviously you've got like extinction rebellion at the moment in the UK like holding up footpaths and bridges and stuff and really important things like that so everyone's really taking taking the environmentalism into their own hands but it's down to the definition of what your definition of waste is right they always say that and this article specifically they mentioned the New York Times on they mentioned about the the waste right in securing the network but it's not waste because it's securing a network just because that hash didn't make it through it doesn't mean it's a wasted hash it was still an attempt at securing the network and it succeeded in assisting to secure the network otherwise if it was too easy it would use hardly any electricity and the network wouldn't be secure. Ah ha no one ever thinks of that when they write these articles but it's all down to personal preference isn't it right it's like it's just because they disagree with something then you can find any reason you want to disagree to hate it you know it's like if people used to moan about like annual like mobile phone upgrades and stuff that's a waste to someone but to other people who need that split second of faster processing time it's not waste it's usage if you have a car instead of a moped when it's just you just yourself and you don't really carry stuff about then you know you're wasting in having a car instead of a moped but you know there's comfort there's extra things that you have and with Bitcoin it's securing the network but just before I finish one thing that's quite interesting for it from you know just because looking back on New York Times articles there's that famous one or infamous one from 1903 December 8th and it said and I quote man won't fly for a million years so don't believe everything you read in the New York Times you I agree with Dan I don't I don't think the New York understand New York Times understands proof of work mining I think that they look at that system and they say all the other miners who don't get the block are wasting their time they don't understand that it's a competition to get that number and that that number is truth right it's mathematical truth and they're competing to get it once they achieve that yes all the other attempts are thrown out but it's that competition that keeps the network secure that keeps the next block timely that makes this thing a race so I don't think they understand that also they continue to ignore the galaxy digital report that said Bitcoin used like one seventh of play stations and other always on devices it uses one tenth of the banking system and it uses one tenth of the gold bullion system so once again if invested in the old system you need to have a reason to hate Bitcoin your old reason was that it's only for drug dealers and criminals that's not working anymore you also used to say that you're going to lose all your money it's going to zero but instead it went to 50,000 again right none of your old excuses are working you need a new excuse you've got your trusty friend multiplication and if you multiply Bitcoin's energy use times a thousand it's a thousand times bigger and that's good enough for the headline like Michael Del Castillo was saying Josh Tagala your thoughts on Bitcoin's incredible energy usage yeah I mean if you have a triathlon you know it's bit it's such a waste of energy they should just have this one guy the winner they should just have the winner running and you just watch the winner run and then get the prize like there's no point why I have all these other people competing that makes makes no sense yeah look there's such a such a tired tired old conversation with these people and they they it literally takes 10 seconds of googling because so many people that are serious in this space like ourselves and many others are constantly telling the logical and reasoned evidence-based argument against their fard but they don't they just it's like la la la la like a child and so every time these sorts of articles come out I kind of you know I of course I think what a what a what a childish nonsense but the sad thing is when I think yeah but all those people that read it and then they parrot it and they just they just repeat this is generally the problem with the legacy media is that they can just say whatever because they're in authority people will believe it and you sort of stuck with that and and it's unfortunate but really it people people start to take note when they when they're like yeah but so many people I know have made really good money from it so am I not going to buy it because I believe some nonsense article and you know really the whole PlayStation thing was a real eye opener for many I mean I I pull that stat out and people are like oh oh wow I mean washing machines like you know certain applications are really important in society and the thing is now that we're up against like a trillion dollar market cap you can't just have a small competition to keep this thing secure you need the best security because can you imagine these same people shouting about the energy usage imagine what they'd be shouting if everyone lost their money because of some 51% attack because suddenly I don't know ever I mean it wouldn't happen because it's going theoretically impossible but if it did they would just be oh look at all these poor people lost their money oh yeah well that's why you had all this energy usage you know tool but anyway that's uh at least with that it would be an actual thing where the people have actually lost their money and the media could complain about it Bitcoin or whatever coin had crashed or been hacked or whatever they could say that it would be true this one once again it's kind of fear uncertainty and doubt Bitcoin does use a lot of energy right now we're all Bitcoin supporters so we think it's a good deal like it's a good thing to build an alternative currency system the current currency system is terrible if you don't know that you'd have no reason why that would be a good deal uh the same thing going forward uh if we switched a bit coins just like when we switched to the internet some people didn't like it they weren't ready for it they wanted to wait uh internet is too confusing internet leaves people behind internet you know make you blind that monitor you're looking at will make you blind but it hasn't happened yet I'm still seeing so uh this is the media's new latest and greatest fud uh what other fud do you guys see uh for the media next obviously I think uh you know terrorism is a big one uh what else would you choose Dan uh what will the media get excited about Bitcoin next maybe uh Lady Gaga uses it so it must be bad well I think I think it might get take a trip back to the censorship lane right so so if people store or use it to transmit information that can't be censored uh like there was that that uh back in 2015 they were saying about the the child porn that was on Bitcoin and you know that that's the you know have references or whatever so I think something like that could happen now I think obviously the obvious one is terrorism you know it's user terrorism like that we like you know the you know the the the the plants in in in Afghanistan of uh of cold plants have been using the they're no longer like providing electricity for humans they're just mining Bitcoin and or something like that it's it's I wouldn't say obvious but it's uh it's an it's something that probably could quite easily you know happen um but uh but yeah I think I think something like about the censorship right because what's what seems to be a hot topic now of course is that lots of people really like censorship like censorship and shutting people down and the cancel culture that we have is growing and it's uh and you know you're getting armies of you know forums of people that are just clubbing together and every time they see a post from someone they don't like they'll shut them up by uh doxing them putting the details out there finding out who who they worked for getting them fired you know all that sort of stuff and so I think the censorship part might grow to the extent that um it gets used for some nefarious things and then gets blown out out of proportion censorship is an excellent pick I also think there's something there in the idea of environmental terrorism like if the Taliban start burning a bunch of coal like Stan saying even if they mine Bitcoin or if they just run air conditioners they could burn enough coal to the point where we'd have to negotiate with them to pay them to stop burning the coal it's a whole a new way of uh it's like a suicide bomber in an environmental vest or something uh Josh Tagala what will the media blame next what's wrong with Bitcoin yeah the um yeah of course the the thing is CBDCs uh which is central bank issued crypto uh crypto I've put that in big brackets um once they are released they will release a massive uh just an onslaught of fud they will pull out the the the char point they'll pull out the the terrorism they'll pull out environmentalism they'll pull out um the the the ransomware like you've never seen it before like the worst ransomware ever whole hospitals and police stations and this and that and and people will have to pull back like oh I'm not invested in oh what you're making money off all this evil how dare you don't invest in it um it'll it'll get really really intense uh in terms of the the fight because really in terms of major news um uh we we've seen we've seen that you can algorithmically uh censor the net very very well um and and so this is coming this is coming um it doesn't take much if you if you've got control of rotors if you've got control of a few key media partners if you've got a control of some top echelons uh google or Facebook uh you can algorithmically censor anything you want and uh and then you have basically the whole narrative sorted so um it will happen once the CBDCs come out uh the central bank issued currencies we're we're going to see a hell of a lot of fud so I think it's it's going to be everything it's going to be the whole lot and people have just got to go not not money is money terrorist also wear shoes i wear shoes um it's it's not evil or good it's a thing it's a money and uh this this doesn't make any sense and I really want people to remember this conversation when it does happen because it will happen. Just want to give a shout out to the handful of people watching us live now if you're watching this later on you'll be able to push a thumbs up on youtube right now it looks like restream it is failing for the second week in the row so i'm going to contact them and cancel this software get a refund whatever i have to do because it's obviously absurd if you can't fix it in a week uh and you're not even telling your customers there's a problem uh so apologies to youtube this will be downloaded and uploaded later uh so you have to give us a thumbs up then thanks so much for sticking with us through this uh restream it issue moving on to issue two issued to bitcoin price tops 50k in september push bitcoin is hitting september at a good clip the largest cryptocurrency by market value rose above the fifty thousand dollar level friday for only the fourth time in the last four months seems like a lot of times bitcoin is at the highest intraday level since august 23rd 2021 when it hit fifty thousand four hundred and seventy seven josh the gallo the price of bitcoin going up forever leading all the other altcoins on the way uh no more bear market everything is good go ahead josh unmute right um yeah the the a lot of a lot of what's happening is uh is inflation as well as price discovery of this technology uh where where where and one of the biggest things that turns institutions around is when it hits an all-time high it collapses back down and then it comes back on hits it again that's when they're like huh i thought it was gonna die this time and every time that happens people realize okay these these are just cycles and the technology is still here after so many years more than a decade um and uh and is stronger than ever so yeah i you know now that we've got countries coming on board um 50k is still cheap you Dan Eve yeah it's wild to be back over 50 but four is this fourth time did you say that we four time over 50 it's popped under and back over you know so i think that's that 50s kind of 50s 50s the new 20 right it's the new when it's the new three it you keep on toppling you know toppling yeah just above that little line and then eventually it's gonna pop off again and and josh made a really good point that obviously we went to an all-time high it dipped down we went back down to you know what was it the late 29s or something like at least the early 30s um but now people's ears are pricked up they're like hey it didn't die i thought it was going back to zero that that dude that predicted something once said that it was going to zero uh it hasn't maybe maybe they were wrong um the fact is that again it's just so as well it's so resilient um we've we've lost you know 80% after an all-time high and still come back up and been higher um so the idea that it's it's dead or it's it's dying is definitely you know it's just not the case especially as more infrastructure is being rolled out countries are adopting it you know the reason one is is now Panama right Panama's seems like it's on the cusp of another another country that's dependent on the dollar and now Panama seems to be on the cusp of potentially saying look we'll adopt it as legal tender they're probably waiting a bit to see how it pans out for our salvador and uh and whether everything kind of goes off with a with fireworks or whether it's kind of a quite a smooth transition but uh who knows you know there's there's what five six other countries um in south america alone dependent on the on the dollar so um we'll see how we'll see how the experiment happens in El Salvador and uh see you at 100k it is pretty surprising every time bitcoin does this go down and come all the way back up again uh seeing 50k again it's it's that old thing in your head that once bitcoin sold for 50k it always has the possibility of going back to that price like it's it's never sold for 100k but if it did sell for 100k and it went down it could always go back there it seems to have that power where once it establishes a high high and it's absurd at that time and you probably didn't sell it might be back at that high high a few months or a few weeks later so it's great to see this again and uh it's also interesting to see the altcoins following back up as well sov and reaching even higher uh ethereum's up about 20 30 percent this week uh incredible gains for the altcoins as well uh as bitcoins leads the way moving on to the exit question uh where will you will compete against the bitcoin predictor ball truly the greatest predictor of bitcoin price in all of bitcoin uh this ball has been predicting bitcoin before plan b and the stock to flow model and it's still it says the bitcoins always going up it's amazing like you need a model you need a model and a chart and a bunch of triangles to tell you the bitcoins always going up dan eave the price of bitcoin this time next week higher or lower only up josh segala higher or lower the only ways up magic bitcoin eight ball predictor ball will the price of bitcoin be higher this time next week yes well you don't get any more equivocal than that says yes nothing else just yes check out the wcn clips channel google wcn clips and subscribe we're up to 67 subscribers very strong on our way to a hundred uh looks like people are starting to view these and share these we even have ones right here from last week with gabriel divan martin josh dan myself everybody's here on the wcn clips yeah it's a treasure trove if someone picks on the whole uh energy mining you know problem there are so many in there about energy and mining you can just grab that throw them at it and tell them to shut the hell up that's right moving on to issue three l salvedor bitcoin will soon be legal tender in l salvedor on september 7th just four days away the government's even going further promoting the cryptocurrency by giving three thirty dollars in free bitcoins to citizens who sign up for the national bitcoin wallet known as chivo or cool in english foreigners who invest three bitcoins in the country will be granted residency but wait what kind of country would you live in in l salvedor anti bitcoin law activists arrested in l salvedor l salvedor police have arrested activists mario gomes a vocal critic of the bitcoin law which makes bitcoin legal tender yes he was arrested told the newspaper they were unaware of the reason for the arrest they sent the swat team to compensate to confiscate his computer this is one of the problems of living in a dictatorship dan eve l salvedor bitcoin paradise or bitcoin dictatorship don't step out of line don't spit on the sidewalk be careful where you chew gum give every other scumbag usually i think it's really bad when someone gets arrested by the government for getting in the way of something but because they're rolling about rolling out bitcoin i'll turn a blind eye i'll go on the side you know i'll there what's the what's the word i'll air on the side of caution and think that he probably was doing something naughty so i trust the l salvedor government since they're rolling out bitcoin because that is a sensible thing but you know it's it's it's going to it's obviously really bad right you know you want bitcoin to be rolled out legitimately the last thing you want is for the world to think that there is you know nefariousness in rolling out bitcoin you know bitcoin's already got bad things attached to it then you know you don't want it being rolled out with the news that people are being jailed for no reason just for speaking out about it right because bitcoin's brilliance is in its resilience which rhymes obviously and and the fact and the fact is that it can it can you know it can shrug off and suddenly the price of the infrastructure that's being built shrugs off the rumors about nefariousness or the rumors about at the environmental impact so yeah i think it's it's sad in a way that that that's actually happened because you almost want the l salvedor government to prove the person wrong rather than just arrest them for something but that's kind of what they do in in small government type places the fact is it's probably going to bring in a lot of investment i mean i'm not sure what the power of an l salvedor in uh passport is but you can you know you'll essentially get one for three free bitcoin right be interesting to see how what it does to the exports in l salvedor if they're um encouraging more services to accept bitcoin then you know for for for for bitcoin is people like to you know cash out in in bitcoin right by buying goods and services directly so if if there's more um services being offered and and goods for example from l salvedor then you know even if they're a premium it might send exports through the roof and be really good for their economy um and obviously people are moaning about the fact that it's tax payers that will be paying for some elements of the the buyback process the selling into dollars um but unfortunately taxes largely get wasted on crap anyway so you know at least if it's bringing making the country wealthier um then yeah then then there's a kind of flip side to the fact that some some taxes are being used to to um to fund the development of bitcoin with infrastructure within l salvedor jash shagala i was um really disappointed with this like i was going to head over there i was going to give a tour i was really excited um but i'm not going to support that i look i obviously i don't agree with this gentleman i think it's a great thing uh for anyone to accept and make legal uh something that's so brilliant but to arrest someone for having a point of view and a loud one even is is so uh deplorable and goes against everything that the bitcoin network is even about it's about immutability the concept of being immutable stop muting people you muted that guy what because he he said something you didn't like what kind of a what kind of a like uh what's wrong with you man like i'm talking to the to the dictator here and that's what you are like if you call this personally what are you doing man like they have some self-reflection if you really believe in this technology there's no need to to arrest someone you just say oh well you know it's an interesting point of view and let people discuss it he's not hurting anyone what's your problem it's it's it's absolutely deplorable and you should take a big long hard look at yourself because you're not a credit to your family name you're a shame to your family name that's what i have to say about that and sad now i can never go to El Salvador she the article went on to say that Gomez participated in several forums and video conferences detailing what he considered to be risks and flaws associated with the implementation of the bitcoin law he has also credited with leaking the details of the country's cryptocurrency wallet which was created by the government to control the dollar to bitcoin exchange process and is promoted as the official Salvadorian bitcoin wallet he pointed to several design features which concerned him including the fact that the operating cost of the zero fee service would be paid for with tax money as Josh was saying here it does seem like the dictatorship part of El Salvador is rising to the top now earlier when we covered the stories about El Salvador we went to the Wikipedia and we read about how he came to power he took power right this is a dictatorship he took power he punished his enemies his enemies shut up and now he's in power so this was never a very good fit for bitcoin in fact in the beginning we warned people that the dictator may seem to look as a goal of topping what the dictator in Ukraine did or perhaps the dictator in Russia they're sneaking out millions of dollars they're sneaking out millions of dollars through bank accounts and bank systems and all these complicated ways right and at the end of the day the Ukrainian president took couldn't take his fancy house with him and on the day of the revolution the people busted into the house and and they were in awe they didn't smash it other than the doors and the windows and such to get in but once they got in they they filed by and they looked at the wealth that their president had and they tried to understand it in the concept of their own lives and I fear with this dictator with the bitcoin if the cash grab successful you can fit a lot of bitcoin in a briefcase you can fit a lot of bitcoin in a knapsack or a journal or a piece of paper or anything and it's possible that we're talking about this in a few months or a few years about the entire wealth of the country going out the back door which again it's a dictatorship he already owns all the power he already owns all the wealth there's a difference between inside the United States or inside the European Union and outside if you look at the free state project the New Hampshire people they didn't really want them and they haven't been nice to them but they never arrested them just for being free stators they never arrested them just for having their opinions they rest them when they messed with the system and all that kind of stuff which is a gray area this guy shouldn't have been arrested but it's not a surprise if you know anything about El Salvador and I think it's important for bitcoiners that we don't do this again I know Dan's excited about Panama that might be the one or some other country but it's going to take a developed country adopting bitcoin to get us where we want to go we're not going to be able to substitute that with some undeveloped country that's just not in the position to do it like we're putting them up on a pedestal and I fear that we're setting them up for failure to deploy them they might not be successful so watch out for El Salvador we'll see what's happening soon but it's good that at least there's one place that's covering it reasonable where this doesn't stick out to you this isn't a big surprise for us this is unfortunate I wish it didn't happen I hope he gets out of prison for expressing his idea like we do on this show like when we expressed our ideas about bitcoin eight ten years ago whatever when we started the show we could have been arrested if we were in a country that didn't like bitcoin we could have been jailed our computers taken charges pressed lawyers needed a huge hassle right all the time instead they just let us say whatever we want on the internet so far so good in this country that we're in this is the this is the important thing this is goes all the way back to you know magnetcada this is because this is the idea of expressing but this is also the the base of the scientific method as well is by expressing doubt and working through issues it's something that's core to human evolution and the evolution of ideas and and you know El Salvador do the right thing man like you're doing a you're doing a good thing by bringing this on board you you can save yourself but don't do stuff like this this is really not good man this is really not good this isn't what bitcoin stands for and anyone that is in Bitcoin cheering the mind after this sort of deplorable act I would say you know just cool your boots man well remember the the incompatibilities between democracy and dictatorship democracy demos the people will of the people right the people can overthrow whatever the dictator wants sometimes the people make a horrible mistake sometimes they correct their mistake sometimes they make new mistakes we go with it because democracy is the will of the people and of course the founding fathers debated that and they had different opinions and they weren't really crazy about the raw will of the people but here we have the exact opposite we have the raw will of one person he is in charge of that country if you look back to when he launched the bitcoin law he decided they would have a bitcoin law it wasn't really the senate or the legislator or whatever he decided this would be good and at the time a lot of bitcoiners were like oh this is fine you know he's just stomping on everyone's freedom but for the thing that we like right and you can't do that you have to have the freedom and the thing that you like you can't just have the thing you like you're never going to get there it's going to be a much much much harder road so let's keep an eye on this exit question which country is ready for real bitcoin adoption not this kind of backdoor instituted by a dictator adoption Dan Eve where do you see real bitcoin becoming popular popular but not by central banks right you know and so that's kind of a lot of europe that's out of it right because no one's going to go against the the ECB otherwise there'll be like you know sanctioned out of the EU or something like that and I don't know I don't think there's many places where it is going to be a massively developed country that's pushing you forward because all the developed countries have got central banking infrastructure that are pushing their own crap right they're pushing their own shit coin so they're not going to let bitcoin go through so I think it will be the smaller countries until it snobles and and breaks a big one eventually but yeah I don't certainly don't see that being say you know part of europe for example or obviously North America Canada it might be somewhere in in the east or middle east that does it Joshua Shagala look the bitcoin was made by the internet for the internet the internet cyberspace whatever you want to call it is a place when I go to the UK I use pounds when I go to the US I use US dollars I use Euros in Europe like yeah whatever you think of that they're shickquins they're fear they're filthy they're they're printed out of nowhere they're they're disgusting system I don't like it but when I'm on the internet I use bitcoin I use Ethereum I use crypto I'm not going to like be bothered with any of these countries that say oh now I have a framework so you can pay your taxes in crypto or bitcoin or what I don't care like I'll pay up you know bitcoin's there to save anyway it's a hot all it's I hope that there are cryptos that are also decentralized that are there to to use as currency but generally I think the consensus among many bitcoin is that it's a store of value over time so you know really it's it doesn't need governments it doesn't need institutions even it doesn't need any of that it just needs the internet and voluntary people to come along go hey you know what I'll I'll write you an article for bitcoin or I'll you know do some graphic design for big I'll code I'll code you that website for bitcoin it doesn't need all this extra complexity and and legacy system attaching itself short it will have it because the the whole system is crumbling in on itself globally after the ridiculous shenanigans every country is pulling at the moment so there's really no option but to head into bitcoin so we'll see I think it's a I think it's actually a very clever move of El Salvador I think it's an extremely intelligent move because as the world crumbles and everyone there has got $30 worth of bitcoin that opens a wallet if they hold on to that you know as a country that they could definitely see them their their value rise in terms of you know net positive value I'm I'm still holding out hope for Japan highly technical society so into video games they have that neighborhood that's all video games and neon lights it's got to come from the people we've talked about before how overstock.com accepted bitcoin back in the day but they had to convert it into cash because they couldn't pay their suppliers to buy more widgets in bitcoin we've said on the other side how the consumers wanted to use it but there was nowhere to use it it has to come from both sides at the same time so the suppliers and the businesses have to be ready at the same time that the populace is informed and ready to use it and when I think about that I think about a technological place I think about a place that's leading in chips and designs and video games and stuff like that and I hope it will be Japan I've never been there I don't know if it's actually what I I think it's like but based upon what they told me in the 80s team Japan yeah I mean this is where a dictatorship actually helps because the dictatorship gets rid of the chicken egg problem of just know everyone but because when something becomes legal tender I pretty sure I don't know it's in like this in the west Minnesotism's in the you know and is that once it's legal tender you by law have to accept it so if someone comes to your shop and says I want to pay with this and this is all thing I'm not sure if it's true but apparently you can use stamps it's a legal tender you can use government issues stamps but I've had friends try that on the bus and it didn't go very well so yeah a dictatorship does help but it's much like Star Wars it's the the quick and easy path leads to the dark side and I think that's going to come in as well on this next issue where we talk once more about Twitter tipping issue four I think this is issue four Twitter tipping is back Twitter's allowing profiles to have Bitcoin addresses they're talking about the lightning network and it looks like they're bringing back change tip all over the place this must be especially painful for people who worked at change tip or invested I know change tip had meetings with Twitter back in the day I think they got all the way up to Jack I imagine they told Jack that Twitter tipping was the thing and they had the solution they had lots of users using it they had lots of spam that was going around but the problem is they had that good old centralized database running the whole thing it was never a good idea now Twitter has the lightning network they might even have the option not to hold people's tweets or their tips tips for tweets not to hold their tips and it might work this time Dan Eve your thoughts on Twitter tips back again well yeah there was obviously change tip but like it was a change tip sorry yeah back in the day there was there was also like what was it like people rumors in 2017 that like red coin was going to be the one for for Reddit and so tipping has kind of been been in the you know in the sphere for a while right and and it's a shame that obviously changed it was a centralized service now there's lightning which is the decentralized version obviously of or decentralized layer of Bitcoin and obviously the the transaction fees are so cheap it's it's a lot more feasible to roll out especially if it's Twitter themselves rolling out as infrastructure obviously Jack's heavily heavily endorsing Bitcoin in general but also putting a lot of money into Bitcoin development and yeah I think it's it's it's a positive thing obviously it's sadly relies on the fact that Twitter is a centralized service right so but then again we've heard rumors and I think Jack even said himself that he wants Twitter to be decentralized eventually so I wonder what that would mean for censorship actually what what would will they decentralize the censorship that goes on will you have these kind of elected snopes officials that will censor things or something like that and fact checker I don't know I don't know how that will evolve but certainly it's good for the ecosystem being able to tip someone who makes a good comment or provides information yeah I see is a positive thing now we gotten a lot of trouble back in the day for being critical of change tips so I want to go ahead and address this right up front I think it's a big deal that change tip was just making their own centralized database they were recreating what Bitcoin already does so well they had the ability to access everyone's the accounts they had the ability to steal everyone's money these are not acceptable trade-offs in the time they could have used a more Bitcoin based system but obviously we saw the fees take off a few years later that would have destroyed their company now lightning network wasn't really available at the time it wasn't even an idea yet it was still you know gestating but now that we have lightning network it looks like Twitter can take those key parts of change tip that we disagreed with centralized control ability to control everyone's tips abilities to steal everyone's tips all of that and they can put it into the lightning network where they wouldn't have so much control so technically it's a better time for it the other thing we complained about with change tip was all the spam you get a message about how you got a tip you get a message about claiming your tip you'd get another message you could send all these messages for 10 cents it was the greatest spam tool imaginable you can probably even send them for a penny you get send like five messages to someone for a penny people weren't looking at the spam aspects and while Twitter did turn on some kind of a tip jar a few months ago I don't think I've gotten a single tip so there is something to be said about that spam it does kind of generate the visual the eyeballs I don't know Twitter might be able to fold it into the product better because they have control of the buttons in the interface maybe they can make it less spammy generally I think this is good but I also want to remind people of the story from the time that really helps you understand this there was a a Reddit where lawyers very well off people get paid hundreds of dollars an hour have specialized knowledge that they've built up over time lawyers were volunteering and giving out free legal advice and then someone from change tip win and they're a tip them five dollars it's not about the five dollars the lawyers have lots of money it's about actually giving back as a good thing not everything has to be monetized like trying to put a five dollar on that interaction cheapens it because the lawyer doesn't need the money wasn't asking for it to looking for it and and five dollars just far too low it should be hundreds you know and and that's why it's not being asked for so we have to worry about changing all of our human interactions to oh you liked my tweet I should give you a penny you can like my tweets because they're good you know you can retweet them because you want to share them not because you're going to get a penny or a nickel or whatever it is so we have to watch for that commoditization of all human experience which they were very much into and a lot of other marketing people that's that's a good dollar right there as Bill Hicks would say Joshua Shagall your thoughts on the return of change tip as it seems yeah yeah I remember one of the most offensive sort of things would be you know someone write a big article or something would happen on Reddit and and then a change tip would come in for like you know one quarter of a cent and if you're a hardcore Bitcoiner you're like yeah stack and sat's cool because I know in like 10 years time like right now that would probably be worth 100 bucks or something so be happy but at the time for normal people they're like what the hell it's kind of like I remember typing and saying hey got dude can you at least tip the guy like a buck like throwing less than a cent it's like going up to a bus go who's playing really good music and going oh and and throwing one cent into the bushes next to him and going there you go and walking out like it's it's it's a it's offensive almost like it becomes the opposite of thankful it's kind of weird but um but yeah we didn't have a learning network what I am a little bit concerned about is sort of centralization of massive nodes that everyone sort of plugs into twitters nodes and then data correlation through Twitter across those nodes of course the good thing is the eyeballs people will start to build up and and anyone can start a node so what I'm saying here isn't fired you can actually just see it happening and fire up your own node that plugs into the into twitters node and and plugs into thousands of others so you can be a bridge um and this is the hope that the that the network grows out now and the other day I paid for a book in with lightning 25 bucks and by the way and it just went it was it was like blunt there it is tick no waiting no nothing pre-confirmed like I've had this channel open for so long so it's got so many confirmations non-stable spending that you know it was as I've blocked there it is and it's a pre-confirmed by thousands and thousands of blocks so really great technology I'm I this is actually makes me more excited than any country accepting Bitcoin I think Twitter jumping on the tip tip wagon I think it's it's the old school you know there was another it opens up a lot of stuff as well as people start to see this they get inspired so Satoshi pay is another great service that used to be on Bitcoin and they invented some great stuff over here in mine art in in in in Germany he he invented this fantastic tool where you could instead of having a paywall for article which no one ever hates because you have to pay for an article you haven't read yet you pay for it it lets you see it and then you at first you have to sign up and put your credit card and all this nonsense so that's a massive break that you finally see it and it's a crap article and you know oh we shouldn't read that well he invented was a great way where it would um it would show you the first two paragraphs and then as you scroll down it would flip every paragraph over and the more you scroll down it would keep flipping and every flip from a gray box to the actual paragraph would release a few Satoshi's from the wallet and was just blah blah blah blah blah blah and unfortunately had to use he had to go off and use some other old coin because Bitcoin's fees just got crazy but now with the Lightning Network I hope that this was inspired companies like him his and others to be able to use Bitcoin again for that because it is the safest network and it is the original network so you know let's let's see what happens but yeah super super exciting news I'm really I really can't wait to test it out I want to agree with what Josh said about the problems with Twitter being centralized and that they might have to track these tips they might have to censor or control these tips the same problem came about at early PayPal when PayPal was looking at what to do back in the day before eBay before all that stuff happened they kind of wanted to make a currency like Bitcoin and they understood right away that if you took that currency out of the PayPal wallet and you put it on your computer and you sent it directly from your computer to someone else's computer PayPal has no control over that transaction the same thing is true for Twitter what we're thinking of is something that would be fun for YouTubers or artists or people like us to raise money that'd be great right but at the same time as we talked about earlier the bad people could also use it to raise money in Twitter as a business they can't be they could be held responsible if the bad people raise money on their service use it to do bad things Twitter is the middleman so it's very interesting to see how they implement this how they put some controls on this and again we need to know why they're putting these controls they're putting these controls because they could be held responsible in the legal system for anything done badly with money and there's Twitter absolutely and there's some simple things that Twitter can do right now to help with Bitcoin like really simple things like in the reporting section have a thing saying crypto crypto scam report because right now there's not even that so if someone's saying send me some crypto and I'll send you double back which so many people fall for sad to say but if I see that you know I'll try to report it and it's like this is harmful or this is there's a whole bunch of things but nothing is like this is trying to steal someone's Bitcoin or someone's crypto so it's just simple things like that I wish they would implement it's quite an easy well it's interesting the ground that they're laying their seeds upon Josh is right it's full it's full of fake Twitter accounts it's full of you know imitation scams it's full of you know send me money get a hundred thousand dollars back type scams and now they're going to give all these people crypto wallets and the ability to send some kind of lightning Bitcoin or something from point to point so very dangerous very exciting for the country for the company and moving well into the exit question will Twitter tips be successful will it bring about the ecosystem that they desire Dan Eve I think it's going to have some hunts some obstacles I think it will be taken advantage of in certain ways there will probably be some you know so that the the latest scam will be like focused around I think at the moment there's the one that's just everywhere is like bonus magic or bonus polygon scam and it's just on everything hundreds it's like the new 10,000 ethereum so maybe they'll find a way to take advantage but it's just like the you know when when they card issue is rolled out the NFC on cards and you know but there there were certain people who added the readers and they'd like tap you on the train or whatever and they take 20 20 pound transaction but then eventually you get around that they have measures in place and and they they you know deal with these obstacles and deal with these hurdles so I think ultimately you'll be successful they'll they'll be fun when it rolls out and there'll probably be some scandals here and there but I think I really I think you know Josh made a really good point that it's probably better than a country adopting Bitcoin because you know Twitter is ubiquitous it's around the world you can hook in from anywhere and if you can send money to someone just fire you know a Twitter account and they can use that to pay for goods and services that's a that's a huge thing and it's also desensitizing people to the idea of Bitcoin being bad you know Twitter wouldn't implement Bitcoin Lightning if if I say desensitize that's probably a bad word for it but you know but it makes it familiar right it it takes it out of the realm of oh it's crazy internet money that you can't use anywhere or you can't do anything with to oh I can literally receive Bitcoin right now on my Twitter account you know so I think it's a I think it's a great step and it will be successful in the long run but it will have it's heard of like any new technology adoption and implementation does Josh a gala yeah I've forgotten the question I was just listening to Dan well Twitter tips be successful all right yeah I think so yeah yeah I think so it won't be it it'll take a while to spread so what will be interesting is how long it takes for small amounts because you can go sub Satoshi in in Bitcoin so in Lightning sorry so so it'd be really really interesting to see at the first seed what happens from all the people that do have Bitcoin and to watch it for crawl out and spread across the network I'm really looking forward to the visualizations hopefully they have really good APIs so that people can build visualizations on top of earth and and see what's happening there across the network that that would be really really good uh if Twitter could release those and and we could because otherwise all you see is like oh you know he's got 16 hearts and 12 Satoshi's and it'll be cool if you could set like every time you heart you give us Satoshi or something just I don't know it will just be cool to watch this going around and you know once Satoshi is worth you know one in some countries one sent now which country was it the Czech Czech Republic I just saw that uh yeah so well that's the place where it takes like three thousand to buy a soda or something so yeah at least we're a penny somewhere uh I mean I think it'll work it'll work technically like I believe in the Twitter engineers ability to build this software I don't think they're going to screw it up but I've had a lot of time to think about Twitter tips and tips in general and I worry about introducing monetary instruments into this conversation we have this conversation going on Twitter you you like my post because they're good you retweet them you reply if you think of something clever to say or maybe we have an agreement or you're like oh I did that too or I had that happen as well and we have a conversation back and forth it has nothing to do with money but the many you institute money into it it's like someone replies and they say good job I really liked your tweet but someone else replies they say good job and they give you a dollar which response is better like the dollar or the one with the more information right we have to look at how this might cheapen our conversation how it might change our conversation I know we already have people company media other people that are looking for clicks right they're looking for tweets and there's all kinds of tweets in Bitcoin where it's like Bitcoin price going to the moon and it's by a pretty girl and it gets 500 retweets right well maybe it also gets 500 bucks in the future I mean is it better is it worse are they paid are they paying people I think it just it changes the conversation you've got something what I think of is relatively organic on Twitter although there is a lot of bots and there's a lot of fake accounts but I think we have an organic conversation there and I worry what the influence of money on a large scale could do to our conversation but again I don't have a choice it I think it's happening go ahead Josh it's a really interesting point you make there and one one of the things that you think about is that people think that likes our currency but they aren't a currency because you don't collect them and spend them forward it would be different if likes you didn't you started with none like you couldn't give any until you got some but but with Twitter you can like as many things you know so it's not effectively not a currency what what what I think some of the positives come to come out of this or some of the things that might come out of this are like initial Twitter offerings and stuff like that where people get a whole bunch of collect start collecting funds for project through Twitter and they will I think be able to see all the all the accounts that that you know tip them and then be able to issue tokens to those accounts in other ways somehow like you're logging with Twitter into the page to to redeem your through Minimask or Web 3 sort of things so there's all sorts of things coming with this I think it'll really open up the world to a whole lot of things that we don't even can't even dream up yet so yeah let's see what happens yeah only tweets yeah exactly moving on to issue five China central bank Bitcoin has no value can central bankers kill Bitcoin well as we all know if you ask a question in the headline the answers always know so central bankers cannot kill Bitcoin but China's central bank saying that Bitcoin has no value continuing to attack Bitcoin after banning the currency after banning the miners it almost seems like the Chinese government has no control over stopping Bitcoin and is resorting to calling Bitcoin names and using mean language to try to control the foreign currency that they can't keep out of their system Dan Eve can central bankers kill Bitcoin and is the Chinese bank right Bitcoin has no value that that title immediately makes me think of that South Park episode make love not walkraft for it's like we're dealing with someone with absolutely no life how do you kill that which has no life you know if it has no if it has no value it would be easy to kill that's the that's the point it's the problem is it has lots of value so much value that it's over a or nearly a trillion dollars again of value therefore it's probably bloody hard to kill and I think that that doesn't can self-references the fact that the miners are being switched you know there's there's signs of miners being switched back on right it's just the the whack-a-mo what happened the not all the miners as we kind of thought went just went abroad or whatever a lot of them just shifted to a more subtle place maybe they will see you know China cracking down like in in the UK recently there was a raid on a Bitcoin mining operation and they thought they thought it was like it was you know people were growing massive you know massive loads of cannabis because of all the heat coming off but obviously it was the heat from the miners so you know that that whack-a-mo is just going to continue but you can't kill Bitcoin so obviously they can keep on tightening the reins it's very hard on censorship at the moment the CCP so maybe the social credit scoring system will have more people you know earning huge credits for dobbling in miners and trying to kill it in that way or people snitching on others for using Bitcoin and they'll get extra credits extra digital renimby for for dobbling in on their and snitching on their on their friends and peers for using Bitcoin but ultimately it just can't be killed and this has been proven you know time and time again with China you think that because they they'd they'd um they'd banned it multiple times and it just keeps on coming back keep people keep on using it um it's just not going to work and I think that the the main thing is that it it it it's almost like they're just funding it right now because they have got this their own digital currency that they've been working on probably longer than any other country so it's the timing of that right they're just trying to put out some fard just before the release of their own crypt their own digital currency and for them it's a massive threat that Bitcoin's 50k it's a massive threat if it goes even bigger threat double the 50k threat if it goes to 100k because they're going to have a lot to compete against right but I actually had someone message me the other day from from an old treasury team I worked with and they were like oh so this digital wand you think it's going to pump and I'm like well it's it's kind of not like Bitcoin um but it's even getting to people in the West right it's got people there's people now who are genuinely interested in in getting in on this CDBC uh CBDC CBDC but CBDC um but yeah you can keep whacking them all but it will pop out out out from another hole I think it must be an incredibly frustrating time to be a central banker imagine you started your way out you were a teller you were helping customers you became the bank manager you became the boss of the bank the CEO and you worked your way all the way up to central bank and now it's your time to manage economies and regulate the world and you've got tons of money there is an infinite amount of cash that the federal is an infinite infinite amount of cash for you to work with but every time you try to bring your powers to bear your life becomes a Scooby-Doo episode and you're sitting there screaming at those darn kids and they're stupid Bitcoin right it keeps ruining everything you want to do it leaks all the money out they beat all your capital controls you banned it you banned the miners like Dan said you're going to use social credit scoring to try to find miners like they're doing in Texas except they're trying to find abortion people uh but yeah you're even using vigilante mobs to get your justice to stop that Bitcoin but there it is again Scooby-Doo those darn kids and their dog ruining everything Josh Shagalla what do you think about the central bankers is it really so bad I'd love I'd love them to ask all the millions of people on buy and ads and cracker and and coin base if it has no value uh what they should actually do is um is sell Bitcoin for a buck see what happens see if uh see if it gets bought or not um it's just such a it's it's the typical sort of nonsense from Megalamaniacal narcissistic uh sort of leader dictator types that like well obviously this stuff just doesn't have value it just doesn't have value like when it it literally has value like you it lit there is nobody zero person no one that will sell you Bitcoin for a buck like uh and that that even is value like like okay it's the most it's the dumbest thing to it's not dumb it's like delusional it's delusional and and uh it's it's kind of sad that these des spots have to go around pretending uh that they know stuff but like I don't know what to say to the man like maybe go see a shrink like find out what happened to you and your childhood or something because you know what what's going on you know what if if you can't trust an unelected dictator who can you trust and like our friend a man would always say he was always saying like you don't need a blockchain you need a therapist that's funny all right moving on to the exit question i'm not sure on this one which uh we've had pretty much ridiculous bitcoin statements from from everyone up and down the line uh who will make a ridiculous statement about bitcoin next will it be the president of some country will it be some CEO maybe a related industry dan eave who will speak out against this bitcoin scourged next well i'm gonna i'm gonna flip it and i and i think that uh that that that that one of the threats will be if like trump comes out in in in uh in dorsing bitcoin and then that'll be bad for it because everyone will be like oh blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah you know but um i i think that obviously the central bankers are the ones that comment on it on it most um there's not many kind of people in power obviously apart from that el Salvador that have really talked about bitcoin right there's uh uh i but i suppose i think jibadans mentioned mentioned it i know that people like elizabeth warren and some of the other democrats have mentioned it from an environmental perspective um but uh i i i i'd boris johnson i don't think he's mentioned anything about bitcoin yet um so i i don't know i think i think that i think it may be a previous president's might but uh or president leet previous leaders might but i think that i think that if it's it's being ignored largely by what by certain world leaders or current world leaders because they don't want people to know about it they don't want because as soon as someone does say it right as soon as one of these world leaders does say it then it will have people talking about it so if you don't mention it people won't talk about it then they won't learn about it so you just leave it to the you know leave it to the the minions to talk about it amongst themselves and only when it becomes a true threat or a true opportunity that's when they'll actually talk about it uh commute i want to go with a complex answer for my answer i want to say that the tally bond who should probably accept bitcoin it would probably be useful to them they will come out against it even though it could be useful to them and they will cry about how it's the evil great satan's money and all these things and we'll have that interesting thing where the tally ban and trump or the tally ban and uh other economic people that we don't like that we disagree with they all hate bitcoin and then we're like that's that's strange that's just strange josh igala who will come out for or against bitcoin next i don't know the dhalai lama how about the pope come on yeah the pope the pope will be good he'll say it's uh it's the god's money it's uh dhalai lama will say he'll have a little chakughe it's great yeah i don't know man i i i i i i would be great if they ask the dhalai lama about bitcoin be curious to see what you have to say so uh we're reaching towards the end of the show they keep removing products from our our store on shop.worldcrypto network.com we're down to just the world crypto network logo i i go in and i try to fix this on t spring used to be called t spring i think they're changing their name to like spring or something but i go in and i push the relaunch button but nothing happens so i guess i have to re upload all the images and create new things but for right now you can only buy world crypto network the mug and world crypto network the t-shirt they're still available our amazing no-profit sales uh but they are our items seem to be expiring on there so it's getting less and less exciting on shop.worldcrypto network.com left to try to fix that uh dan eave are you ready with a prediction or a story of the week regard to you first because we know you're ready. i i'm just going to go for something lame and i i'm going to say that i i don't think we are in fact way i'm going to i'm going to check that we're above 50k right now because otherwise that prediction isn't going to work very well and yeah okay right okay so it's fit apparently according to core market cap love it or hate it uh it's 50 thousand one hundred and thirty dollars so i'm going to say that this will be the last time that bitcoin goes under 50k and that we may even hit 55 by next Friday and i'll remember that prediction and call myself out when i'm wrong if i'm wrong. Josh so gala um uh uh man we uh we did pre-market distribution on last few few days ago and uh it's like 95% or something like that sold out so that was really really exciting the community came and uh supported the project so we're really excited about that and the uh did a couple of really great AMAs about the project so i'm super happy and one of uh you know i just can't wait to get on with building this thing one thing that really i love about this space is that we haven't had to go and uh and uh get on our knees to some vcs we could just actually ask the community hey what do you think of this let's build this and and they're like yeah let's do it and so you know this is really uh grass root stuff so i'm really really really happy about that and uh yeah i i could just can't wait to start building uh really cool tech saffi punks right codes thing very cool uh i just want to give a shout out this week to Theo Goodman uh Theo was a big promoter of rare pepe's and as we've talked about on this show a couple weeks ago a couple months ago kirao cards got rediscovered which everyone knew was a good sign that what we'd be saying today is true rare pepe's have been rediscovered the market for rare pepe's is exploding people are telling me that theo might buy a private island somewhere uh so i hope theos doing very well i hope he has a lot of rare pepe's uh there's this great one that i found this week called the co-bane pepe and i think i knew about this in the time but i you kind of slides by with all this stuff on twitter uh but what's great about co-bane pepe is that he's wearing a mad bitcoins t-shirt and that mad bitcoins is also a pepe on the t-shirt so mad bitcoins was included in the rare pepe collection uh so it's really cool uh to have this happen and to be you know mad bitcoins is in kirao cards and in rare pepe's yeah i got a mad bitcoins kirao card but you got to get the rare pepe next but there even more rare it's a series of only a hundred and as it says here as Kurt Cobain said i didn't realize i'd made it until i saw the weird owl video and in the same way it's pretty surreal to see uh Kurt Cobain pepe wearing a mad bitcoins pepe t-shirt so shout out all rare pepe's and all the NFT projects uh there's plenty for everybody i've always thought there was plenty of collectors for everybody there was a lot of competition and just like between the projects back in the day but let's put that to the side let's just celebrate everybody and shout out to theo i hope theos doing well yeah man i i haven't got a see here tomorrow well there they go tell me game a shout out we're for these rare pepe's and yeah we all just want to have uh you know we want to hang out on the private island yeah totally man i uh you know the where are they are they getting wrapped into into the usc 20s or are they being sold somewhere else where they being sold uh some action uh people wrapping them on open sea although i've heard just a warning i've heard a possible fake rare pepe's on open sea i don't know the details but everyone at your own risk you can buy them directly with a counterparty wallet uh free wallet or the rare pepe wallet i don't know but people are buying them it's happening there's a market for sure yeah amazing amazing all right give a shout out to theo when you see him and i will i will sure uh but sorry to everyone a re-stream it isn't working again this week we have the same configuration there's nothing fancy about it nothing's changed uh so i'm going to contact them try to cancel see if i can get my money back and next week we're going to stream this directly to youtube so hopefully that will work but this is sad because it means everyone watching now on twitter and our one guy on twitch and our nobody on facebook uh you'll all be left out so make sure you tune in to youtube check us out on twitter there'll be a link to the youtube uh but hopefully you can find the show if not we'll do what we do now we're gonna download the show and upload the show so it will be up on youtube eventually it's just taking us longer because this strange uh re-stream it this is kind of your job uh you re-stream things and if you fail i can't work with you anymore so it's been a good time on re-stream it i hope everyone enjoyed being on many platforms but two weeks in a row failure uh you got to go so uh that's about it i think we're out of time until next time bye bye