The Bitcoin Group, the American Original. For over the last 10 seconds, the sharpest Satoshi's, the best Bitcoin's, the hardest cryptocurrency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists. Ben Arck from BTC Socialist. Hello. CEO Goodman from Proof of Work Media. Greetings, everyone. And I'm Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network, moving on to issue one. Issue one, Bitcoin, clobbered in market sell-off. The Dow Jones industrial average declined 800 points in a single day this week, dragging down both Bitcoin and precious metals. The price of a single Bitcoin declined more than 14% over the week, on some days declining as much as 10%. Is Bitcoin no longer a safe haven asset, or was the fear of the inverted yield curve in the bond market enough to rattle even a veteran? Hodler, Ben Arck. I don't actually think that we're related. So I still think Bitcoin is a hedge against the markets. It's just we have this crazy plus token thing, the Ponzi scheme in China, where there was like a $3 billion worth of Bitcoin, which they're starting to sell off on all the exchanges, which has just obviously increased the supply, and then that's dropped the price of Bitcoin. The Dow Jones stuff is very concerning. The real problem there is the US China trade war, the stuff going on Hong Kong, back home here. The stuff going on. So companies, they don't know where to put their money, they don't know where to invest, which means that capital, just as a whole, the world economy just starts to splutter. You also got the US obviously pumping dollars into all their businesses and pushing their share prices up, so it has to stop eventually. So I think if it weren't for the plus token problem, then Bitcoin would have gone up. It's just kind of a minor little blip, and I really don't think that the two things are correlated. I don't think Bitcoin is going down with the Dow. I just think it's had a separate massive event, which has affected its price. So, yeah, I mean, this is just sort of the problem with capital in general, is it needs to keep it continuing growing, and it needs space to grow, and needs markets to go into, it needs room to grow. And if it can't grow, if that growth is restricted, that's when you end up with economy spluttering, and then going into recession. So you mentioned the inverted bond yield curve, so that's where the treasury bonds, because people are sort of forecasting doom and gloom on the horizon, they buy up the long-term treasury bonds. So then the price of the return on the short-term treasury bonds is increased to try and encourage people to buy the short-term treasury bonds. And the usual sort of curve, healthy curve, which you have in the bonds, is then inverted, and that's where you end up with that inverted yield curve, which is quite serious business. So the past six times it's done that we've had crashes, so including 2008. We've already seen Germany have one quarter of negative growth. If there's two quarters, that's a recession. Yeah, exactly. So, I mean, we've all been forecasting this for a long time, so it's amazing it's kind of continued to go on as long as it has. It's just quite scary in the real questions, and what do people do next? Do they, are they laissez faire? The Austrians would suggest, or do we try and do some sort of surplus recycling? The Keynesians might suggest, so yeah, so it's brace yourselves, hold you a bit coin. Yeah, times are going to get a bit scary, I think. Theo Goodman, are we spluttering a technical term? We're spluttering, we're falling, we're sloshing, we're doing everything in between, in a short term. You know, there was a quite a big dump, but that's just Bitcoin things. That's just hashtag just Bitcoin thing. That's normal, that's how this market is. If you're surprised by that, then I don't know where you've been. It does those kind of things. And also, media needs to have narratives, especially crypto, anything about crypto. So you need to find, you know, find in your, you know, the glass ball, the crystal ball, like some kind of weird correlation. Events going on, put them all together, and then you have like a nice clickbait, and then people will start believing it that they're correlated. But they're not necessarily correlated, like Dow going down and Bitcoin going down the same day. But there are people were talking about them on the same day, so that's good. But what I mean to say in general, nothing really changed. The people just sold off. If you were freaked out by one market, sold all the other markets, and you had a pile of cash at the end of the day. So there's some truth to that though, actually. So first, people go to cash, yeah, or Fiat, yeah. Then they might invest in gold, in Bitcoin, and everything else. But if people are scared, first thing markets are probably going to do is go to Fiat first, before they probably won't go directly to other assets. Maybe you're seeing that now with some people, but that will be probably the first impulse. Something interesting though is about with all the negative interest rates going on. Like it's becoming, people are kind of realizing what is going on. They just saw just recently a German insurance company basically said, look, we're going to start holding cash from our clients in our own saves, in our own vaults. Because if we give it to the bank, we have to pay because of the negative interest. So it's getting really weird. So bear assets, whether that's Bitcoin, gold, cash, whatever, are becoming more interesting. And mainstream people are starting to kind of see these reports. And think, what the hell is that? Something is wrong. So all the stuff, two or three years or five or 10 years ago that you said about this kind of stuff, is now coming true. And it's no longer a conspiracy theory. The economy is so good. We have new experiments and negative interest rates. New experiments indeed, negative interest rates. If you have more than $500,000 in the bank, the bank will charge you for holding it because the bank can't find a better, safer investment to put that money into. As Ben was talking about, we also have the inverted yield curve. Whereas recently, the value of a 30-year bond dipped below the value of a 10-year bond, now the value of the 10-year bond has dipped below the value of the two-year bond. You'd be better off buying two-year bonds. So it's better to invest in the short term than the long term. This is bad for the entire society. This is the draining out of the money. But is it? It's also important to mention that that is a symptom. So it's a supply and demand because so many people are buying the long term bonds, that means that they push the price of the short term bonds to make them more attractive to people to buy. So it means that a lot of people are securing their money, they're locking down their money, they're taking out markets, and that's why I ended with these crashes and recessions and stuff. But it's not causing a recession. I don't know, it's chicken and egg stuff, I suppose. But it's more of a symptom at this point. But then obviously lots and lots of people with money in the markets will see that indicator and then they'll react to it. So it's pretty scary. The more scary thing is, the trade wars in the economic conflicts have an tendency to turn into real conflicts. Look at the Brits and what we did to China with the opium wars, where they refused to buy our opium, so we stormed in there and killed a bunch of Chinese people, then forced them at gunpoint to sign a trade deal, saying they would buy our opium back in the day, back when we had the pounders of war reserve currency. So it's not beyond the realm of possibility that the US could, not maybe not do exactly that, but the economic stuff which is going on now can easily roll into a real war. So that's what we done on that. Yeah, Bitcoin wars are upon us. As great to see, we have a very stable leader in the United States who would never start a trade war with China for no reason and with no strategy to win, no exit strategy. Oh, but it's time for us to move on to the exit question. The price of Bitcoin this time next week, higher or lower, then much much higher. I mean, obviously I'm not revising people to buy this stuff, but the plus token thing pushed the price down and it should be going up quite a lot considering what's happening in the regular normal markets. Theo Goodman. Sub 10k party in a submarine. And now we have a special appearance from Bitcoin talk show. We have the Bitcoin price tracker. Will the price of Bitcoin be higher next week? And it is don't count on it. Don't count on it. Not looking good from the Bitcoin price tracker. Moving on to issue two, China coin. China coin. First Facebook now China. The people's bank of China is on the verge of releasing their own cryptocurrency solution. While China has banned several times in the past, they seem to be in hurry to take control of their people's money with a new sovereign currency. Theo Goodman, I ask you, will China coin be a success? This could be a success depends on what you define a success. The so-called China coin, what it will enable though, if it's a some kind of cryptographic token blockchain, something something, is that it will allow them to control, have more control over that token. So right now they don't have a lot of governments can't control cash once it's out there. It's always hard to control. They can try to collect it. They can try to collect right now. They're trying to collect like the 500 euro bills, for example, you know, and get them out of circulation because they can't control that. So if you have negative interest rates, you might have a bank run because people don't want to hold all of their money in the bank. Right? But if you have one of these like government controlled stablecoins, you can just like zap freeze accounts. You can control the supply a lot easier. So it might be a success for more of a totalitarian control. And combine that with your social score. And you've got your China coin with you. So from that point of view, for controlling people, it will be maybe a success. I don't think it's going to be the next coin on Trex or Polo that's going to be pumping, but it might be a success for controlling people. Leo is not gathering bags of China coin. Then arc. Yeah, and I imagine it's going to be pretty stable. So it's not going to go up so much. But in the article which you send there, Samsung Mao, there was a tweet, you link to a tweet which was looking at the original article from the PBOC. And who's saying it's very bullish like they know what Bitcoin is. They know how it works. And in the article they're explaining why Bitcoin's valuable, why it goes up in price, blah, blah, blah. And like why they need something like Bitcoin. So it's only a matter of time until they eventually realize that they should just probably use Bitcoin, particularly because a lot of the reason for them pulling this China coin forward in its development, I think it's to do with the trade war stuff and to try and get around some of those trade tariffs. Which I quite like in a way. It's a bit like that John Gilmore quote about the net seeing censorship as damage and rooting around it. The dollar is the US trying to censor the dollar. The dollar in digital world is the finding ways to kind of root around it and the Chinese are finding ways to root around it. But I mean China, they've had a long tradition of being good with money, being able to manage money while they had the Wu Shui coin, which is a longest lifespan of any coin ever, which is 750 years or something. So it's a moment a little square in the middle. It was pretty cool. So yeah, no, I think they're very capable of producing something which is useful. But like Theo's reservations, I'm sure they'll use it to kind of try and control people, which kind of sucks. It was interesting in the article, he said that when Mr. Chang Chun, who's the guy, the PBOC, one of the PCPBOC guys, he said it wouldn't solely rely on blockchain technology because of the transaction volumes. So that would imply that there is some sort of blockchain and then maybe they're using something like an iron hand. The iron hand that will sort all transactions. You can trust in the iron hand. But I mean, it's just a case of all these companies and countries and whatever else, they're just going to be gravitating slowly towards Bitcoin. And we all know that we've just got to sit here to the lothams and wait for it to happen. I agree with Ben, it's great that China is taking attention to Bitcoin. It's great that they know about Bitcoin. But slow down everybody. We're still in that phase where China copies Bitcoin. Just like Facebook, just like Amazon, just like rumors are out there. They're saying Walmart, just like everybody else with all these goofy stocks and everything, they see Bitcoin. They say, how can I make money with that? Well, it turns out the easiest way they think to make money with it is to make a copy of it. China's making a copy of it. Facebook's making a copy of it. Walmart making a copy of it. They're all making a copy of it. And they're going to try to sell it. So it's the same old game. They've printed their own money. Let's see how that goes. But we're in the middle phase. Eventually, they will have to adopt real Bitcoin, real lightning, but just not yet. Right? One more time. One more time they want to print some money. Any more on this topic? Yeah, I just want to say that like I think any market where you have kind of a proprietary and then you have a pre-nopen source, eventually the pre-nopen source will just utterly consume it like in the market of web servers. Or you know, think of a good copy left stuff, you know. So like something like Wikipedia, you know, look at the encyclopedia market. How will that's doing right now? Like once you get something which is pre-nopen source or copy left, then if there has a monopoly, then it's a good monopoly. Like if Facebook had a monopoly on money, that would be a bad monopoly. Bitcoin has a monopoly on money, with that would be a good monopoly. So it's just my retirement. Till the pre-nopen source, alternative will just consume all the proprietary, controlled versions of it. Theo, more on this? No, I'm fine. All right, let's move on to the exit question, which will have a greater impact on the world, China coin or Facebook coin. Theo Goodman. Theo's. Theo's the amazing blockchain within a blockchain. Ben Ark. I'm sure you're going to say again, to Ruffle People's Fathers. By quite likely, Bruthing is an interesting project. If it works, you know, so it would be the stablecoins, kill or stablecoins. So I'm rooting for Libra. It'll be a great way to pay someone if you didn't already have PayPal, Venmo, and all the other things that are other great ways to pay someone. If only we had as many ways to pay people as we had instant messenger applications, that's my dream for the future. Did you know? The World Crypto Network has its own audio podcast on Apple iTunes and many other podcast platforms? Just search for the World Crypto Network. Look, we've got more than 300 episodes, including new episodes almost every day. Give us a review on podcasts. The World Crypto Network, audio podcasts. Issue three, Bitcoin and Gold. Bitcoin or Gold. Bitcoin. Is Gold? The price of gold recently soared, breaking $1,500, and perhaps signaling a renewed interest in the legacy asset as the world enters a period of increasing turmoil. However, Gold is heavy, takes up space, and is difficult to send over great distances. If only there were a digital version of Gold. Maybe something like Bitcoin. Ben, Ark, your thoughts is Bitcoin the new digital gold or will real gold be making a comeback? Yeah, man. If we could digitize gold and then just put on the internet, then we just use that. But we can't because obviously it's a real world, solid, metal, heavy thing. So we can't do that. We've tried it before in the past with the E-Gold. E-Gold, I think. So by having gold back tokens and trying to peg stuff to gold, it's pretty difficult. Bitcoin, Bitcoin is the way you know, the first digitally discussed, you didn't exist on the internet before Bitcoin or data could be copied. It's the most scarce, valuable data on the whole planet. It is a commodity. It's very much like gold. And I think the evolution of its use is kind of like gold as well. In that, you know, we see it's like, we've seen that shiny rock, and we think it's got value and we pass it between each other. And we're like, oh, and we're doing the same with Bitcoin. We see it's got value and we're sort of passing it between each other. They're not really know what to do with it, making goofy little projects and whatever. But I think as many commodity uses as just a digitally scarce material data, which has value attached to it. So we get to see all those commodity uses be explored. And so that'll be really interesting to see. I think it's very much got very similar to properties to gold. It's not either all, but I imagine as we move into a more digital world, then Bitcoin is probably the answer. And you know, if we are all eventually going to upload ourselves into some sort of computer game, whatever, then we'll need something and Bitcoin's going to be the thing. It's not going to be physical gold. And that's I think that's where we're probably leaning towards. But I mean, no, at the moment. So for the past nine years, gold has tried to break like, you know, 1370. It broke it. And then we've got the Dow Jones stuff going on. What we at now? Like, we got 14, 50, 50, or what we at 1500 some of that. So gold, gold's got a long way to go. It could go much, much, much higher. That's a Bitcoin. You know, it's the recent price action in Bitcoin. It's just a red herring, you know, just ignore it. It'll do the same as gold. It'll go up. So yeah, so it's a bit scary, like for the rest of the world and the sort of stability of the world, gold going up. But it's been a long time due. And you know, I'm happy for all these gold bugs. Or they'll have an inkling that maybe trumps a gold bug. And this is always a six scam. Destroy the markets, make gold go up. And then we're off with the money. He only likes gold in his decorations. The price of gold is around 1500 USD. The Dow Jones is around 26,000, maybe 25,000, depending on the moment of the day. Gold finger like gold finger like the decorations of using gold in his decorating. So, you know, he might be a Trump little King Midas. So many great examples of people who gathered up gold like a smog, the dragon, and the hobbit. Great characters that one would want to shape one's life after. Theo Goodman. Is Bitcoin the new gold? No, it's Bitcoin. Bitcoin is maybe more like digitized, beanie babies or digitized other collectibles or something like that. Just like, you know, just like we mentioned, you know, it's something that we people find valuable. They like to collect it. They like to hoard it. They have a number in this program, the software called a wallet. It has this logo, the golden B, the orange B. And all the people in cars behind me heard me say Bitcoin. They came right over here because they want to get some because everyone is talking about it. And that's definitely something. There's a few key differences though. We know how many Bitcoin will ever be. That's one real key difference. And we don't know how much gold is out there and we don't know how easy it will be to mine asteroids or other things like that. So there's still things. I mean, that sounds ridiculous now. But if gold goes up, if it starts moaning, then so will the exploration to define gold, all of those old gold mines that were mined in the first gold rushes will be revisited. People will try to check those out. So we don't know, you know, the supply of gold. Something they both have in common is that it takes a lot of energy to mine Bitcoin. It takes a lot of energy to mine gold. So, you know, they have a lot of things in common. I think they're just different. And I think that people should have both because, you know, gold is heavy, but you don't need internet for gold. So it's kind of, it's not exactly yin and yang, but they're definitely have pros and cons. Leo's right with gold. It's all about the rarity. Gold has not a fixed supply. Bitcoin has a fixed supply. Mining asteroids either remotely or bringing them into the orbit with Earth will be possible as well as what Theo was saying going back into the mines maybe even using drones or underground miners to go to places where humans couldn't go. Many of these mines were tapped by human miners. Let's give the, or maybe robots a try. But if you did it or you could do it or you could do an ICO and pay people in tokens to go mine gold in the old mines or on asteroids or whatever, you know. I mean, I think we're going to see more and more of that stuff if the price goes up. The sounds sounds crazy, but I mean, why not? I mean, we've got block stream satellite. Why not have, you know, some like shit coin ICO that's trying to mine gold from like some weird asteroid. I mean, sounds totally reasonable. It really is all about the tokens like Ben was saying. A world of warcraft players online profiles. They have no use for gold. However, like Theo was saying in a zombie apocalypse and a breakdown of society type situation, it's easier to trade gold offline than it is to trade Bitcoin. But you just need to make sure you have your gold in those little breakable bars, those little smaller pieces, coins, stuff like that. Trading a whole bar, even if you're willing to cut off slivers can be very difficult. I remember I warned you many times you need those small whiskey bottles. Not the large whiskey bottle. Go ahead Ben, disagree with me. No, no, I'm not going to disagree with you, but I was talking to Christian Rooosal about the post-apocalyptic Bitcoin thing. And we were, because at the moment, I mean, trying to build a hardware wallet on like these little, you know, like devices you buy, because it has like the cool property of they're not super secure or anything, but you don't have like the supply chain. Attack, which you might get with like a regular normal hardware wallet, where the companies know they're building a hardware wallet. Like these are just little devices, very generic and well documented, no pencil and stuff. But we were thinking like a lot of the hardware, like in ESP32, like most IOT type devices, you'll buy like, you know, your fancy little light bulb, which you can use your phone to change color. They'll have an ESP32 in it, so you could like in the future, if you wanted to, you could smash these things up, take the controllers out and then turn them into a little hardware and then we were imagining like, if you had like a satellite, you could have a small community, which could be, you know, trading and all sorts of stuff, but they could kind of settle in something like Bitcoin, and they could be clucked into, they could be like a digital, you know, a worldwide economy, which still exists. And we could still be able to communicate without, obviously, this is the hope, isn't it, to be able to use it without the internet. So yeah, I think we should make a web, a worldwide web. We could make a worldwide web. Not just have one server like Facebook.com or Google.com, but a web multiple, sir. Can you imagine if you're amazing, wouldn't it? So yeah, no, so I think we could, I think there is, hopefully there'll be the possibilities you see some Bitcoin in, in, you know, walk in dead type post-apocalyptic stuff, scenario, sister-to-girls. You can't smoke a bit, quite. That's true. Oh, the audience is laughing at that one. I was also going to say, let's again, appreciate the price moves of Bitcoin. Like Theo was saying, we just went from 13,000 back to 9,000, wherever we are right now. It was a wild ride. It was a lot of fun. I wish I had sold more at the top, all that kind of thing. Same old thing, but you never know where the top is. But look at these gold bugs. They've been fighting for years to get from 1200 to 1500. And they're very happy about it. So let's not take the Bitcoin as advantage. Let's enjoy the price moves that we have. All right, moving on to the exit question, what would you rather have, a thousand dollars in Bitcoin or a thousand dollars in gold? Ben Arck. There's only one on this, but obviously Bitcoin here. Theo Goodman. Oh, yeah, Bitcoin, obviously. But I will tell you an interesting thing. It's harder to sell a thousand dollars worth of gold. You're more likely to trade, use the Bitcoin to buy something that you shouldn't or whatever, than if you got a thousand dollars. So if you want like a physical time lock, high friction to sell, then do the gold. If you're cool with holding and you can control yourself, then do the Bitcoin. Oh, definitely a thousand dollars in gold. You could get wallpaper. You could sit on it. It'd be heavy. You could throw it at someone. Has all kinds of uses. You guys are just not thinking outside the box here. Moving on to issue four, block stream mining. It turns out that block stream has been busy. In addition to employing many core developers and working on the new liquid side chains, block stream is also mining Bitcoin on a massive scale. With multiple mining facilities in a sum total of more than six, exa-hashes in mining power, which recently would have amounted to 10% of the total Bitcoin network. The company claims they entered the mining space in 2017 to counter Bitcoin centralization. And will continue to do so by expanding the better hash protocol. Yo, goodman. Is block stream mining good for Bitcoin? It doesn't matter who mines Bitcoin. The rules for mining don't change. That's the whole beauty of it. It makes absolutely no difference. As long as you're willing to do the proof of work, then it doesn't matter who mines Bitcoin. So I don't think it's good or bad. It's just the freedom that the protocol allows. If they want to, if four stream wants to mine Bitcoin, they can mine Bitcoin. If Thomas Hunt wants to mine Bitcoin, he can mine Bitcoin. It's all up to you. Just generate equal true on your wall. There you go. I agree with you. It doesn't matter. Anyone can mine Bitcoin. But it doesn't exactly help block streams reputation that they were secretly mining Bitcoin in the background for maybe a couple of years now. That's all mining is like that. That's not, that's the serious. All warfare is darkness, the beating of intersects. Yeah, they're competing with each other. So it's totally normal that people don't tell you anything, I mean, or tell you false information, and not all the information about a mining operation. That's part of the whole game. So I don't think that that's good business. And actually it should be so now everyone that says, you have a, what is Borkstream's business plan? They don't make any money. They just get investments from the free mason's and whatever. And they're destroying Bitcoin. Okay, well now you have a, hey, they make money by my name. So now I guess that leads to another conspiracy that, whatever reason that's bad too. They also made presumably smart choices to hold a lot of Bitcoins because they had deals with their employees to pay their employees with Bitcoin. If they bought the Bitcoin at the time of these deals and just held it, they would offset the cost of paying these employees no matter what the price of Bitcoin moved. Seeing it go up in value means they have a lot more Bitcoin, as well as with this mining operation, if they are able to hold some of the Bitcoin that they mine, they're in a stronger position as well as the price seems to be on the rebound. Then from Wales. Yeah, no, the big cash is going to love it aren't they? They're going to use this as a mo for a while. So yeah, it was just tough to weather that one. I mean, it does kind of matter who's mining in a way because the profits they make, someone like G-Han, you don't really want him having access to all that money because you just have obviously pisses up a wall like trying to wage war and trying to control Bitcoin, whereas like Blockstream so far, as far as I've seen, they've always had the correct attitude towards Bitcoin as a free and open source project. The proprietary stuff is there to support the free and open source stuff, not the other way round, which I think is the problem with people like Roger and G-Han. They thought the free and open source stuff was there to support their business models and it's really not. And Blockstream seems to have that pretty much penned down, obviously. Yeah, they already use a profit swell to employ a lot of core developers and you've got Matt Karillo with his BetterHash, which he's been working on and you've got a whole bunch of interesting. Funny actually, because I was speaking to someone, I don't know if he's employed by, but I don't know if he has any, but I don't know if he is employed by Blockstream. I was speaking to someone quite important and they did well, allude. I was having a few drinks of the methane and they did allude to something big on the horizon. And then I think this is probably it. I'm amazed. How did you build these facilities without somebody finding out that these huge mining operations are being built and you've got these invested? How did the news not sneak out? I think that's an incredible bit of, I don't know, just organizations to be able to make sure that that news doesn't get out. But I think in 2017, I think we all realized that mining was an issue. And although the UASF stuff was cool, and it kind of like told the Mike, showed the miners who really is in control and it's the users, it took its toll on the community and on people. And I think that's kind of a last resort thing and it's important to make mining a little bit more honest and I think Blockstream and people like my co-relo with better things like Berhash are trying to do that. So I think it's absolutely fantastic. It's great news. There's so much bullish stuff going on in my own mind. As well as this, we've got, there's tons of bullish things going on for Bitcoin. And Fidelity as well, I mean, for what I've heard, Fidelity is super-psyched on the technology. They're a super-legit company which has been operating for many years. So that's also super-exciting and it's great to hear that they're a client of Blockstreams. So yeah, it's great, it's great. I'm really excited about it. They had two listed customers of Blockstream where Fidelity, like Ben said, and Reed Hoffman, owner of LinkedIn, although he sold it to, I sold it to Microsoft but he used to be one of the PayPal guys. So I would got early money going there. Let's move on to the exit question. Who do you trust more to mine Bitcoin? The companies that build the miners or the programmers who write the code, Theo Goodman? I don't need to trust either one of them mining his mining. Ben Arck. Yeah, see, I was going to say the developers, but Theo is absolutely right. There should be no trust there. Yeah, thanks. Trust no one. Moving on to the bonus issue. Coinbase acquires Zappo custody to become the largest crypto custodian. That's right, it's happened. Zappo has sold out. What started as a laptop in Wencesen's vault has become a massive underground Swiss bunker, full of private keys. Those private keys will now be managed by Coinbase. How lucky we are that all of the Bitcoin industry seems to be centralizing around us. What a great deal for Coinbase and Zappo customers. You'll be safer together. Nothing will ever happen to this money. Ben from Wales is the Zappo Coinbase merger. Good for Bitcoin. I don't know, I'm hopefully it'll be good for Coinbase because the perfumes and to pull some good talent into their company. A lot of these mergers, the reason they pay so much for these companies is really the talent in the company. So hopefully that talent will come into Coinbase and improve it somewhat. It is a problem. Coinbase are on issue, so I'm only still running. This is going to happen. The people with big pockets are going to buy up all these interesting companies. But then, like we've seen with the blockchain stuff, there's lots of stuff going on in the background. So I've got too much to sound it really. But it is one of these. Theo Goodman, is this going to be more like Google acquiring YouTube or like Yahoo acquiring Tumblr? That's a tough one. That's a tough one. I will say that. I think that maybe they have some talent. Let's not forget not too long ago. What was that other company that Coinbase bought? I mean, you have to ask yourself. The Coinbase buys ZAPO because there were some kind of data terrorists that were supporting really evil, helping governments to find people and stuff in surveillance and all this kind of stuff like that other company they bought or they just bought ZAPO because they have cool, you know, a nice customer base and probably that's what they have. Maybe ZAPO got a nice cash out on it. That is something that happens though in industries that they consolidate around a few successful companies that have a lot of capital, that have a war chest. But it's a crack in it is buying a lot of companies too in the background. There's a lot of stuff going on. So it's not just Coinbase buying up companies. There's a lot of consolidation going on and people are looking for talent. They're looking for intellectual property. They're looking for customer base, just typical things that you would be looking for if you want to buy up companies. So I don't think it's, I mean, Coinbase is not my favorite company for some of the reasons that I said. But I'm not worried about it as far as like centralization of the industry or something. We are seeing a de-risking of ZAPO. ZAPO is very lucky here. They're exiting the custody market. But Coinbase is really emptying, emptying, entering it. We're seeing Coinbase acquire a massive amount of keys, a massive amount of wealth, and a massive responsibility. Coinbase's site goes down every time the price of Bitcoin goes up. Coinbase never had a vault for a long time and many of my friends were robbed by having their Coinbase accounts broken either just with the password getting stolen to a V-A not working. That resetting of your phone with the Verizon and the T-Mobile and the other companies and they'll reset your phone. Coinbase has never reimbursed anyone for any of this and they never will. But it's interesting to see them move forward and acquire this company, like Theo said they acquired that other company with all the hackers. They also acquired Earn.com, which used to be, I don't even remember it now, but they used to make miners and they were going to solve Bitcoin. What was it Theo? It had a $21.21.co or something like that. Oh, that was it. Yeah, they're like, we're going to put miners and toasters. We're going to put miners and this is our big product. It's a Raspberry Pi with a big fan that costs 500 bucks. And the mining equipment is already outdated. And it doesn't do anything for our bank accounts, but we never wasted $150 million of anyone's money to build nothing, to then sell it to Coinbase with this pay people to read email plan. But that's all happening. They say, Bellagy is a there's a great article recently about internal struggles at Coinbase Bellagy versus this other guy. And then Brian Armstrong at the top just kind of letting it all happen, seeing how it turns out. And I'm pretty sure all these major lieutenants are going to leave Coinbase. And they'll just be Brian at the top again. So we'll see how it goes. A very interesting major company merging with another major company. Also shout out to Zappo for winning the original BitGive bowling tournament. I think it was back in 2014, maybe 2015. Check out the Mad Bittcoins archives on YouTube. And you can see Zappo winning the BitGive bowling tournament over Coinbase over Kraken over BTC jam over many other Bitcoin companies that probably don't exist anymore. But it was a classic event. We've got one more bonus issue as a major news day. We're having to add these to the schedule. Backed says that it's cleared to launch Bitcoin futures next month. That's right. Backed the Intercontinental exchanges young subsidy announced Friday that it had acquired a New York State Trust Charter through NYDFS. And it was going to allow them to launch futures products on September 23rd. We've had futures in Bitcoin before. Theo, I think I remember last time everyone thought it would be great. And the price went up a little bit. And then the futures people ate us for lunch and the price went down forever and forever. So Theo, is it good that we've got backed futures entering the market? Well, these are different futures. I believe these are the physically settled futures. These are not cash settled futures. So that means that so cash settled future means that you just get paid the difference of the price movement in cash. And so it would be in fiat value. So if it moves $100 and you're up and you're you're a long one Bitcoin, then you gained $100 and you get paid $100. Whereas this one physically settled feature is then settled in that asset. So it's then settled in Bitcoin. So it's a little bit different. I mean, you have to look you'd have to like have a whole episode to explain that basically. But it just means that it doesn't I would say that it has less of a short pressure. It doesn't have the same kind of short pressure that cashbacks can have. So it's not going to cause the price to go down as much as the other futures. That's your prediction. We're not doing investment in tax. I have an idea. Okay, so theoretically, so theoretically, the utility of this one will be that if you're a business and you want to hold Bitcoin overnight, then you could you could use this this product as a type of insurance essentially. So that could that could enable people businesses to actually hold Bitcoin overnight and then you can and then yeah, you you'd use this back thing as as a form of insurance. That would be an example of a utility of backs as one reason people are excited about it. Because if you're a big company like Starbuff, since we need to buy a coffee and you have like a shitload of Bitcoin that you've collected because everyone wants to buy coffee with Bitcoin, let's just say then you might need to hedge that risk and then you would need an American based product and you'd need physical physically settled would would be good. So that would be that could be an advantageous. Then are you excited by physically settled Bitcoin? Is this finally going to get us the coffee that we want? I think it is quite quite big news. I mean, like you say, it's probably worth a whole show and it's kind of like you know, we've only just heard about it now in the past couple of hours. I don't do too much about it, but I do know it's physically settled and that's quite important. I also know that they back they know what Bitcoin is and they've had lots of meetings with people like from the SEC and from other sort of agencies and they're fully regulated in New York and they're educating these people on what Bitcoin's value proposition is and why it's an important asset should people should be allowed to trade with. As Theo said as well, I think like a pretty sure local Bitcoin traders use futures for like hedging their risk, you know, if they buy some Bitcoin and then they can sell some and just so in case the price drops and they can invest in some futures as well. So, no, it's a really useful tool for people and for companies and yeah, with it being physically settled, that will take more Bitcoin off the market, I guess, because I suppose. So that will restrict supply and push the price up. So I again, something which is to me sounds very bullish, but I do need to read it more on it. I don't know too much. Well, it sounds great to me and I would love a Frappuccino. I had the other day, it was some more as flavored one with soy milk. Oh, it was amazing. But let's go ahead and move on to prediction or story of the week. Then we're putting you on the spot. Are you ready with a prediction or a story of the week? It's been quite a while since we've been on. So any kind of story from the past couple months would be great. Okay, so I've got my story of the week is that I sent the M5 stack sat. I sent one of those to room 77 and they had Bitcoin meetup yesterday and they were using it and Yorg the owner, apparently had goose pumps when he was using it. So it went well and enjoyed using it as well. I've got one over there and they've got these amazing little charging based things. I'll be doing a tutorial for that at some point putting it on the network of course. And my prediction is that I'm going to do it now is I predict that we're going to have a world first that somebody's going to pay Bitcoin on lightning network for actual lightning. And that's going to be me right now. So let's try and do it with our electric human myself. Okay, so what I've got, I'm going to have to put my headphones off. What I've got over here is a Jacobs ladder with about 4,000 volts which are about to run through it. So I shouldn't really put my hand too close. I've got, can you see, can you see this? Not if you can. Can you see this little thing here? So this is just the, it's another, it's like the simpler version of this project without the keypad. So it's just a sort of screen module. So it's the M5 stack itself without this development kit on top of it. And on my GitHub, it's M5 stack one to one. And that's our BTC on GitHub if you want to check that out. So I'm going to pay a QR code on there. And then hopefully I'm going to cause, you know, some actual real lightning. So I'm going to plug this bad boy in, wish me luck. Okay, so we've got a green light. Alright, so I've got to open my wallet. And now I'll try not to kill myself because obviously, you know, your 230 volt for system at home can easily kill you. So 4,000 volts can do a lot of damage. I'm not going to get too close to it. So I'm going to take a little while. Okay, it's going to pay. We're in there. Okay, how would I use my shit coin? It would have been faster. See that says pay. So I'm going to pay. And then hopefully. How cool is that? I've just paid Bitcoin. I paid once a Tashi for some real lightning. So I'll just let that flick on in the background. It should turn off in a second. There we are. Actual. That's the world first. Very cool. Lightning for lightning right here. I'm a lightning man. Don't network. Thanks so much. Ben. Alright, Theo, do you have a prediction or a story of the week? Well, Ben probably electrocutes himself. I have I have I have a prediction and story of the week in one. And my prediction is that I'm going to see the device that was just described to us in room 77. It's coming week. And the story of the week is me being in Berlin next week. At a well, I don't have a ticket for web three summit. So if you have one, you can give it to me. But I'll be around there. It's some of the surrounding events. And then I'll be at Let's see. What is it? It's called Dapcon and I'll be at East Berlin to that Mike and I'll probably will be at Thing is, of course, everything has everyone has to plan it. It's also chaos communication camp. But that's like out in the country in the middle of nowhere. But that's also really cool. So there's a lot of stuff going on in your Berlin next week. And of course, it all has to happen at the exact same time. But if you're around, then I just get up with me. All right. Very cool. Check out Theo in Berlin at room 77 and maybe even at CCC chaos communications camp. I've heard very good things. I have very little time left to spend in Europe. So I have to save it for Prague and the Transylvania conference. So thanks again to everybody who donated. I'm back home. I had a great trip in Europe. I was gone a couple of months. It's a pretty long time. I went to a lot of places. Mainly Barcelona also Germany, Netherlands, Germany and a little bit of time in Athens. I was able to do some tourism. It was really neat. So I had a great time on tour. I'm glad to be back home. We're trying to record more shows for you. Had a frustrating day today. I don't know if you joined me today for Bitcoin talk show. We had a lot of stops and starts. We were working with open broadcaster. It was skipping. Google obviously killed Google Hangouts. We're in a Hangouts list environment right now. We're trying out this Skype thing. We don't know how well it's going to work. We're going to upload the video later. I had a kind of neat idea. We'll probably do one of the premiere videos. So maybe Ben, Theo and myself can join you in the chat live for the premiere of the Bitcoin group that you're probably watching right now. Maybe we're even still hanging out in the chat. We're going to keep working with this. Even without Google Hangouts, we're going to look into Zoom. People are saying Discord. Skype kind of works. We'll see how that works. Of course, open broadcaster is pretty cool, but the new version didn't load for me. So not happy with that. But we're going to keep working with it. Because eventually it lets you have little buttons and switch screens and does all kinds of neat things. But we're going to keep working with that. And here's one more thing. Here's the donation screen. At least this is a recent donation screen. So if you'd like to donate Bitcoin, it's even got buttons for things called Ethereum, Litecoin, Doge, Dash, Vertcoin and Ethereum classic. These will all go into the world crypto network and help us continue to make new shows. Be sure to check out and subscribe down below. Give us a thumbs up and a share. Check out all the new shows this week. We've got more things from conferences. We've got proof of work interview with Adam back and Max Hillbrand. We've got Ben with the tutorials. We've got some newcomers, Mike and Rita, who have been doing some interviews for us at the Barcelona trading conference while I was in Barcelona. So we helped them out. So check those out. Give them some thumbs up and some positive comments. And maybe Theo will be on here soon with some room 77 using that switch box things. It sounds great. So thanks so much for joining us. Until next time. Bye. Bye. Bye.