music The Bitcoin Group, the American Original, for over the last ten years, the sharpest Satoshi's, the best bitcoins, the hardest crypto currency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists, Dan Eave, the crypto raptor. How do you happy Friday, Fuchs? Victoria Jones from Satoshi's page. Evening all? Time, Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network. Moving on to issue one. Issue one. The European Central Bank has issued a report about Bitcoin. And they say Bitcoin is the problem. They say that early adopters of Bitcoin are increasing their wealth at the expense of those who didn't buy it, that the new Lamborghini Rolex, VIA, and equity portfolios by early Bitcoin investors are financed by diminishing consumption and wealth of those who do initially do not hold Bitcoin. Just like people who bought Microsoft stock early, or people who bought Apple stock early. Oh, those people. They also say that Bitcoin's inelasticity, the inability for more Bitcoin to be creative, will leave less Bitcoin available for early adopters. Dan, Eve, it seems like we've been talking about this publicly for over a decade here. Yes, getting into Bitcoin early is good. What can't the ECB understand about this? How is Bitcoin so different than say Microsoft or Facebook stock? Well, it's crazy how they don't see the irony here that they're saying about putting all your faith into Bitcoin when your other faith that you put into is in the institutions that have given us sky high inflation, devalued our currency. You made a really good point about stocks, anything where there has the ability to go up in value, gold, that's still saying that anyone who gets into gold early is, if everyone just aches into gold, then gold's going to go up and people without it going to be poor. They might as well just say that no one knows anything that goes up in value. And if they wanted that, then they should just not print money. The whole point of printing money is reversing the effect on the economy. It's making it bad for people, especially the lowering come people, because the money just ends up getting fun into the larger companies, which then goes into the pockets of politicians anyway. The ECB itself during COVID alone printed 1.2 trillion euros, which is more than the entire market cap of Bitcoin right now, which is just about right. I can't remember the exact value is, but certainly if you were to the market, it would pump a lot. But that's a huge sum of money. And that's just one central bank or central bank outfit that are printing money, that are low in the US that printed a bunch as well and other economies around the world. So it really doesn't make much sense this article. And it just seems to be another, you know, dude, shouts at the sky and the clouds because they're using all these old talking points. They've mentioned in there about the fact that Bitcoin's used for the various things. It's just recycling all this old material. And yeah, and I think we can all see the danger in CDBCs that are coming and this cashless society. It is a disappointing report from the ECB. And as you were saying about stocks, then usually with stocks, you can't even invest early. I think everyone who used Facebook early on thought it was a good idea. And sure, you know, we had a hundred bucks, we had a thousand bucks. We're not accredited investors. We're not a startup incubator. We can't go to Zuck and say here, you know, take my thousand, give me some early shares, only select people like Ash and Kushner and other people were able to get those shares. By the time the other things got to us, whereas we've said for years that Bitcoin was a chance for a normal people to get that early chance at something. This was something that wasn't on the market yet. Wasn't in an ETF. Wasn't, you know, you go to your stockbroker, say you want to buy Bitcoin, say what are you talking about? They didn't have micro strategy or any of these ETF alternatives. We told them to invest. If they didn't invest, I don't know. We told them. Victoria Jones, what do you think about the ECB's new report saying that early adopters will profit too much from Bitcoin? Well, you know, I think it's a classic case of projection from a group of people spouting sour grapes who have benefited from them, can tell an effect for thousands of years. I mean, you know, really is anyone going to take this article seriously, but of course, you know, it's a classic case of the fact that, you know, a lot of people have been taking these articles seriously. It's amazing how you can twist things when you have an agenda to push. And so, you know, basically now that everyone's starting to adopt Bitcoin, it's becoming more, more important to companies. And they're starting to realize that they've missed out. And so now they want to turn all the early investors into the bad guys, just as we're turning all the people who invested in stocks early into bad guys. You know, the world is inherently unfair. And of course, the way in which the fear system has been set up, it's been set up in such a way that when the rules don't suit them, they can change the rules so that they do suit them. The one thing about Bitcoin is they can't change the rules so that it suits them, which actually is going to lead to a system that's way fairer than has ever been fair when they were running the system. So, you know, I really think they need to wind their necks in and let Bitcoin do what it needs to do. It is interesting in the article that says that the Bitcoin takeover, the redistribution of wealth and purchasing power is unlikely to occur without detrimental consequences for our society. So I wonder what they mean there. They're pretty much talking about the computer keeps taking over the world, which I see is a good thing. Let's go to the exit question, Dan Eve. Will this lead to detrimental consequences if Bitcoin takes over? Oh, I mean, it's going to lead to people that are really, really pissed off that they've missed the boat and still are continuing to miss the boat now. But it's, you know, even BlackRock is saying that you should have what 1% of your balance sheet and assets should be in Bitcoin, I think, might be more than that. So if you've got the biggest company on, like, biggest company on earth, it's more for at least funds under management and all these other ETFs that are coming out there and other banking institutions that are actually saying, well, banks themselves, they're saying investment, you know, vessels that are saying you should be investing in Bitcoin and part in Bitcoin is this going against this ECB report. And the report itself is just, again, it's just ludicrous. It's just another stab at Bitcoin because they know that the ECB is going to lose power lose because they're not going to be able to control the monetary policy. They're just jealous, essentially, that they can't print more Bitcoin. I think that I'm seeing mentioned in the article that I, oh, this Bitcoin, you can't even print more of it. Like, yeah, that's, that's literally the point. You're like, exactly. And that's why people have been asking people and begging people to invest in Bitcoin and to understand it for so long, exactly because of the issuance structure. And because of how, yes, there'll be less Bitcoin later on. So you should buy them early on. Victoria Jones, what do you think should we let the tech people take over with Bitcoin? Or is it too scary? Well, in terms of there being negative consequences on society, I think certainly in terms of the way in which society has been structured up till now, then yes, there will be negative consequences because Bitcoin is designed to disrupt all of that, you know, many respects. The way in which the world has been set up and up until now has been unfair. And the invention of Bitcoin is an opportunity to make it fairer. You know, the thing about Bitcoin is that if you don't manage it responsibly or you spend it too early or you don't take care of it or you don't manage your debts properly, there's no one to bail you out. You know, you are completely responsible for your assets. And there are many powerful people over time who have not managed their assets responsibly. And you also get that difference with generations as well. There may well be companies like Michael Sailors where they're holding onto the Bitcoin, they understand the benefits of it. But then, you know, making sure that the generations are after, actually look after it in order to keep it going as a legacy for society, you know, traditionally often that's where things have gone wrong where the next generations haven't been able to look after these things. And so, you know, as Bitcoin progresses and becomes more adopted and, you know, it's then passed down to the next generations, you know, the ones who haven't been involved in its development and persuading people that this is a new way of the future. You know, when those new generations start making bad decisions, that's when Bitcoin starts to become redistributed. And so, you know, this is something that's going to play out for decades and other generations. And I think in the fullness of time, it is going to make society much fairer than it has been in the past. And I definitely think that's a good thing. It'll be interesting to see how it turns out with the generations. It was a long time ago, but I think I read in a William Gibson book about a future where a family company had launched an AI and then the family company went into hibernation. And every once in a while, the AI had to wake up one of the family members and kind of get them to sign off on some expenditures or something like that. So, and at a certain point, I'm not sure if the family was controlling things or the AI was controlling things. And again, this is 20 years ago. These Gibson books have been out. These ideas have been out there. But now, we might actually see them come to life. So, I'll be very interesting. Moving on to issue two, Microsoft urges shareholders to reject Bitcoin investment proposal. Yes, software giant Microsoft has advised its shareholders to vote against a proposal that would urge the company to invest in Bitcoin. Now, why are they having this? It could be because micro strategy outperformed Microsoft by 300% this year, and they don't even make anything. They don't even have to have any customer support, any servers or anything like that. Victoria Jones, what do you think about the idea that Microsoft could invest in Bitcoin and should they? Is it better than being a software company? Yeah, I think we're reaching a stage now with Bitcoin where even companies are starting to recognize that not having an exposure to Bitcoin at all is maybe a very naive thing to do. I think we're a long way off. Being the full size of its allocation, but certainly all credit to Michael Saliff leading the charge in terms of encouraging companies to take an interest in this when a lot of companies do still have cash on their balance sheet given how the finances of the world are currently set up. It's negligent, frankly, not to at least have some exposure to this. I think it's good that companies are starting to understand, although clearly Microsoft, the board of Microsoft are fighting against it because they're still in denial that Bitcoin is as powerful as it is and can continue to be that powerful. But certainly, I think some savvy people on their board realize that even if it's just a small allocation of their assets, it's now becoming necessary when they look at the difference it's making to their competitors such as MicroStrategy. It is so interesting that MicroStrategy's basic idea, which is the same idea as this Ponzi scheme from early Bitcoin, even before my time, called Pirate at 40. What he would say is you would give him money, he would buy Bitcoin for you, and he would hold it. It's the same thing as MicroStrategy. Decades early, unfortunately, for those invested in Pirate at 40, it turned out allegedly that it was a Ponzi scheme, of course, the central man taking in the funds, paying off the old investments with the new money, and only continuing if he can keep taking in new money to pay off the old money. MicroStrategy is different, but we have seen cracks in the legendary MicroStrategy armor as I predicted. Bitcoiners always eat their heroes, and their heroes are never as ideologically pure as they want them to be. MicroStrategy, Michael Sailor, came out this week pretty much against self-custody, saying that these weird cipher punks with their offline wallets saved up because they were holding their own funds. That naturally, and I'm not sure where he gets this, but that would naturally lead to a 6502 gold seizure, similar to what FDR did during the Great Depression. So, that's a big jump. During your assets at home, leads to that automatically, or maybe it's just Bitcoin, I'm not sure. Dan, what do you think about Microsoft and their decision to or not invest in Bitcoin? Well, Bill Gates once said that Bitcoin's a tech-tour-to-force right. So, it sounds like he had some positive words to say about it and told that it can be very disruptive. What's interesting is that what Starship Schrodinger's destiny in the chat says, who's making the proposal if the management team think it should be rejected? Seems odd, right? They're saying, we're going to make a proposal to put it on a balance sheet, but we don't think it should. It seems like a problem. I think the proposal is the proposals from Microsoft shareholders. So they must have some kind of a system where shareholders could say like Starbucks or whatever we should do this. We should do that. This is an investing in Bitcoin measure. So it is interesting, but it is coming from the shareholders, I believe. Yeah. So I mean, again, the irony, the fact that Microsoft led a tech revolution along with Apple, I suppose, but they've put most of the computers around the world for a long period. And so for them to not see the opportunity that Bitcoin is a technology, you can give you a strange, especially when Apple has been investigating blockchain for a while, right? And they're trying to position themselves in the space somehow. And Microsoft is probably going to be losing the trail on that and going backwards really in comparison. Maybe they're just waiting for a to see if it needs a Windows update or something before they get involved. But largely, it just seems crazy that such a big tech company isn't trying to jump in on this or at least going lightly. And what between 2014 and 2018, they accepted Bitcoin in the Xbox store or something. I think it was the Xbox store. They then stopped that for some reason. So yeah, just it's just an odd situation where such a big tech company is, is it odds with with the biggest tech revolution we have now apart from AI? Maybe it's just that they've put all their A to one basket, right? They invested a billion and then 10 billion in open AI recently. So maybe that all their eggs are in the AI basket and they're thinking like, oh, they say, in fact, it wasn't who's the Gary Gensler? Didn't Gary Gensler say at one point he said, oh, this Bitcoin stuff's just BS compared to AI. So obviously AI is huge, right? So maybe Microsoft taking the board is taking advisory from Gensler. The fact that he's saying, right, you know, forget about Bitcoin for now, you know, it's still going to a while. Let's focus on AI maybe. There's still so much work in AI. You have to make a product. You have to market it. You have to get people to use it. You have to somehow make money off them. Maybe a subscription fee. I don't know. Whereas Bitcoin, you just put it on your balance sheet and it just sits there and makes your company money, which goes into the exit question, is it a slippery slope? Are these companies worried that if say Microsoft took 5%, 10% of their money put it into Bitcoin, looked at the return of the end of the year and as Dan is saying, instead of investing in AI and all the jobs and all these managers and whatever else they employ at Microsoft, we should have just invested in Bitcoin and did nothing. Is that why they don't want to do it? Victoria Jones. Yeah, I think we mentioned last time we were on, you know, the Argentinian billionaire, you know, figured that one out straight away. It's almost like an intelligence test to figure out whether or not, you know, this is the thing that you should be doing. And, you know, clearly there's conflict with their own agendas that's holding them back. But, you know, logically, it's a no-brainer and Michael Sala has demonstrated that to everybody. I mean, clearly there are other issues with Michael Sala's philosophy, but when it comes to companies holding Bitcoin on their balance sheet, you know, why would you not? So, yeah, crazy, really. He's backed, as he backed Tracked on the self-custody thing, right? He did, it seems like that. He's done, he's, he shared a podcast or some sort of video on how to self-custody, but it was pretty crazy, right? He came out with that and said that, you know, insinuated that kind of thing. From his perspective, I don't think it was that crazy. It's only these Bitcoiners that want to hold their own money. It's the only of these Bitcoiners that want to send value around without a third party. Starting from the old financial world, I think he's expressing kind of a truism where he's like, yeah, your money is better off in a bank or in an ETF or in a holding facility, especially for someone like Michael Sala who's been so rich for so long. He's probably talking about stacks and stacks of money, not normal people money. But yeah, he might have overstepped for the Bitcoin audience, but I don't think that the financial audience would be like, oh yeah, don't keep your hundreds of thousands of dollars at home, you know, on the coffee table, not shocking advice from the financial sector. Like, yeah, that is very true. But as Victoria was saying that that Mexican billionaire was right on it in a second. Samson Mous pushing him saying, you have all these power stations with all this power, you should mine Bitcoin, anything to himself. I get all these containers full of computers. I get these geeks to run them. They switch the computers in and out. We do all this work. And then he says to Samson very plainly, and clearly he says, why don't I just buy the Bitcoin now? How do I need to do all that work? I'll just buy and hold Bitcoin. And Samson doesn't have much of an answer for him. He's a very slick guy these days, but didn't seem to have an answer for that guy. But we'll have to see how it goes with Microsoft and the vote on their proposal. Obviously, if the company doesn't want to do it, it doesn't matter if some shareholders likely Bitcoiners submitted this proposal. It probably gets as far as this show. I don't think that Microsoft is going to significantly invest in Bitcoin. But we will get to say next year, how much could Microsoft have made if they did invest in Bitcoin? So that'll be fun. Check out worldcryptonetwork.com. We've got 4,050 videos. If you watched them all, it would take you three months, 20 days and eight hours with no breaks. You can check them out at worldcryptonetwork.com. Moving on to issue three. Bitcoin rights bill passed by the Pennsylvania House with bipartisan backing, protecting the right to self-custody crypto. As we are saying with Michael Saylor and others, coming out against the simple practice of holding your own keys, being your own bank, kind of one of the core Bitcoin ideas that we and many others have espoused over the years has now been encoded and enshrined into law in Pennsylvania. Dan, what do you think about Pennsylvania protecting the right to self-custody Bitcoin, even as so many others are cracking down and threatening it? Well, what's beautiful about this, right, is that it's bipartisan. They came together and it was quite a, I think, it was 120 years to try to 26. So it was a good show of hands saying, look, this is someone's right to be able to hold their own Bitcoin, hold their own money. And there's been a lot of stick, obviously, with in sunny Europe, they've got this new system where they have to ask questions now. If you're sending your Bitcoin or cryptocurrency way or sending to, do you own the address, who owns the address, if not, you've got to go through these hoops to jump just to be able to move around your cryptocurrency. So it seems like this is a really good bill to protect your right and not have to go through those hoops. And it does fly in the face of CBDCs, right, which will be your kind of KYC addresses. And that kind of, it's obviously a very good thing that you don't have freedom over being able to spread your money if you are self-custodying so that you don't have all of your eggs in one basket. And have all of your Bitcoin in one's seed or one particular private key, it allows you the ability to spread it out and to have that financial privacy that you should have, because let's face it, like you wouldn't want your bedroom being recorded in every movement being recorded by the ECB and one of the authorities. So I think that why I mean except the president, right, president, right, because they've had some really good crypto-friendly regulations in the past. So this seems like it's going to have a bit of a knock on effect from Wyoming to Pennsylvania and hopefully some other states will go along. The other way Canada was saying they're limiting, discussing limiting crypto-holding within retirement accounts, which again is your money that you've worked so hard for and you've paid all this taxes on them. And then you're not allowed to do with it what you want. Now I know that it's in the guys of self-protection, but you could still put all your pension stocks in like biotech and biotech dumps for example or a particular industry or something like that. So you know, apply liberally, right, apply the rule everywhere, but they won't do that because Bitcoin is this big awful thing that they have to come down really hard on. So yeah, not your keys, not your cheese. But you obviously, you can use self-cutting, yeah, self-respecting. Some people I think you totally agree. Some people just don't want the responsibility, right, because that's one of the hardest things that I've had when educating someone on it. They're like, why can't I just put it on a site and then, you know, and that company I can shout at them if I can't get to my money and I'm like, well, give me, you can't get to your money. You know, so there's two sides of the coin, right? And if they've lost your money, they've probably lost everybody's money. Yeah. So, and there's the fear as well of it's a big responsibility, especially if it, you know, this is your life savings. If it's in banks at least at the moment, you can spend it certain, the UK of 80K across the board so that you can, you know, you're protected for the 80,000, whatever it is, wherever that money comes from out, you're printed out of thin air when the banks do screw up again. But at least you've got that sort of, you know, you've got protection and I think people are worried about not having that protection, like holding it themselves. It is, as you said, it's like the idea of having a bunch of gold under your bed and if someone breaks in and studios of gold, boom, it's gone. Like, that's it, you know, you may be, you may possibly be insured for it, but there's that, you know, extreme cases, etc. So there's a, there is a bit of a fear with self-custody. But largely the, the bill, the bill from parents of vineyards are a really good thing because at least it gives people the freedom to choose because that's what people want. If you want to hold your own keys, then hold your own keys. If you don't, then you use a custodian and at least you have the choice. Well, and just like last week, many roads lead back to Andreas Antonopoulos. And Andreas was always telling us how with computer security, we have maybe 30, 40 years of computers with physical security. We have thousands of years. So as ironic as it may be, and again, do what you want. This is, you know, not financial advice or whatever. Many people choose to have a safe deposit box at one or more financial institutions where you could store your private keys safely. You could even put them in a box, in a box, split up the keys in a many keys, put the many keys into many boxes. You could do whatever you like, but this, this secure box technology and the locks and the keys and the guys with guns. That's there. And it's available for you, even with Bitcoin, because if it's offline, you can't access it. And if it's offline in a box or if it's offline under your bed, the only thing that matters is, you know, when the bad guy is come or whatever, they have to go get it at the bank or something. I mean, you have to do that. But as Dan was saying, it was a bipartisan bill passed 176 to 26. And I just want to give a shout out to this group called Satoshi Action Fund. Because they did what I've been begging the big people like Coinbase to do, they went to the bottom. They're starting at the Pennsylvania legislator. They've talked to a state representative, Mike Cobbell. They're not going nationally trying to take the presidential election, trying to take an entire party, things like this. They're starting small. And as you can see here, they're having bipartisan success. So shout out to, I don't know anything about them. I read them in the article here. Shout out to the Satoshi Action Fund. It seems like a good group of Victoria Jones. What do you think about Pennsylvania allowing self custody for their citizens? Yeah. I mean, I think it's excellent work by the Satoshi Action Group. I mean, these are the things that are, these are the goals that are worth pursuing. I mean, I've said many times on this show that, you know, ultimately a Bitcoin disrupts politics, but obviously we've got a long way to go until we get there. And we still need to get to a stage where people, even though we've got the things in place to try and use Bitcoin peer to peer, it's still not easy. And while we're still developing the technology to get there, you know, these rules are very important because this is a system that currently runs society at the moment. And so, you know, having passing these bills helps to, you know, normalize these ideas in the general population and establishes some of the basic freedoms that we, we anticipate should be freely available to us, but obviously history has shown that in the past, if, you know, legislation overreaches, then that's not necessarily the case. It certainly makes it a lot harder. So, yeah, I'm really pleased to see it. And what I was particularly pleased to see was that Lou Ezeana has specifically banned CBDCs, which I think was also a necessary piece of legislation as well. And so, yeah, really pleased to see it. And as you say, Thomas, I think starting with the low hanging fruit is a really good way to try and establish precedent without too many obstacles in the first instance. So, yeah, great work. And it establishes a pattern, a series of dominoes where you can say, hey, this state did it, this state did it. They did it a little differently. We can change it to make it good for your state. You know, we have options here. Whereas if you're starting at the top with a national plan, there's so many states, so many jurisdictions, so many people that want or don't want big coins, very difficult. So, I don't have an exit question for this, but I can tell you that William Penn, the governor and founder of Pennsylvania was born in the church and christened in all halos by the tower. The oldest church in London, it's right next to the tower of London. It's a great old church. They have a crypt. You can go down. You can even see the piece of paper where it says, William Penn was christened here at this church, probably around 1750, 1720, something like that, a very cool church. Let's move on to issue four. Bitcoin is up 125% in the year. Should you buy now? Obviously not financial advice, but yes, yes, you should. We keep going through this where Bitcoin's the best investment of your lifetime. The best time to buy it is when you first hear about it, the second time to buy it is when you second hear about it. We keep going through this every, every four years, it goes up and down. We were as low as I think 17,000 this cycle. Now we're around 68,000. I'm not sure right now. Dan, Eve, what do you think? Obviously not financial advice. We're not saying anyone should do it. But if we were giving financial advice, should they buy Bitcoin now, the general idea? If I was, but I'm not, then, you know, then you know, you know, you know, it was by the general rules. Isn't there like an actual, like a law of Bitcoin that if if you hold it for more than four years, you're almost definitely going to be in profit. Like there's, there's no point in history of Bitcoin where that hasn't happened. So and look at the end of the day, look at the S, look at the S, the S PX and all the other index in X is there. They're doing insanely good, you know, too, well, that good, you know, for a long period. So basically holding anything that's not fair is, is good. You know, you may want to fear it for backup, but you don't even need it now. I was going to say for paying bills and stuff because there's so many services where you can hold your Bitcoin, Siphon small amounts off when you need to to then pay your bills and it will just sell the Bitcoin for you and pay your bills. There's certain governments that are actually accepting Bitcoin now in order to pay your taxes. So there's that option for certain, certain depending on where you live. But I mean, it just seems like a no brainer. It's like, you know, we're, we're what? There's the 2024, it's like 15 years in. It's, it's not going away. That's the main thing. And as we always say, the infrastructure and just and the keeps on developing that more companies using it, more companies holding it, you've got nation states now that are buying it and holding it on their treasury. You have ones like Germany who are unfortunately a bit, you know, a bit insorred as it were because they sold their Bitcoin, which is a really, really bad move. And they didn't they dump it on July 4th as well. That was like, they were so proud. They just kept dumping and the price was going down because they were dumping and they're like, look how smart we are. The price is going down via seclug. Yeah. Yeah. That's a bad another bad move from the government. And imagine how many Germans were just screaming out, no, what are you doing? Like, well, nine, nine. Yeah, it's just it was just a bad move for any government to be selling. And even looking back now, the silk road that was sold to Tim Draper for like 40 odd million back in the day, that's worth insane amounts now. So it just seems like it's not a good thing to do. With inflation still sky high everywhere in many, many places. So yeah, it feels not the thing to be in right now. Just whatever you're doing, don't be in kind of don't be in fear. There's plenty of other things to be invested in, even if you don't trust Bitcoin, you know, and just get out of fear. I think a lot of people have a problem where you say, oh, Bitcoin's $100 and now it's $10,000. They're like, oh, I missed it. And they say Bitcoin's $10,000 and now it's $60,000. They're like, oh, I missed it. And now we're saying that Bitcoin is $60,000 and we're trying to tell you that, and I don't know the times of the day. It's obviously don't have a clock in six months, in three months, whatever it's going to be, it's going to be 120,000, it's going to be 250,000. It's going to dip down, that's going to go back up. Like they really don't understand that things don't just go straight up. We can't just say Bitcoin's the greatest thing ever. It's a million dollars of coin tomorrow. But what we can say is if you put up one of those diagonal charts and the line goes above and below and above and below, at the end of it, it hits a million dollars. And then the crazy part about that, at least again, we're obviously completely biased. Bitcoiners here, it keeps going up. So I think that's the problem. And even as the other article was saying from the ECB, they're getting the lambo's, they're getting the villas, they're going to, you know, all these Bitcoiners every time they do that, they have less Bitcoin. Now a lot of people sure have thousands of Bitcoin or whatever they're set. But most people, when you buy the Lambo, you have less Bitcoin. You're not, you know, buying in more lambo's. And I think eventually it'll, it'll even out. It'll work out. Big Victoria Jones, what do you think? Obviously not financial advice. Bitcoin up 125%. Should they buy it now? I think a good general rule of thumb that's been mentioned before is to just buy a little bit gradually over time and not think about the ups and downs and just see it as a, as a long term investment. I think for the average person, that's more than adequate. You know, some people like the adventure of trying to, you know, assess when it's up and when it's down and, you know, if that's your game, then fair enough. But, you know, in terms of an insurance policy, if your finances longer term, I think just put a little bit aside every month, regardless of whether it's the middle of the cycle, the bottom of the cycle, the top of the cycle, because if you're doing that, you know, it's, you know, over time, it will work out well for you. So that's my advice. It is all about the dollar cost averaging investing something that doesn't bother you. If it goes up and down like a hundred bucks a month or something like that. I often tell my friends like, I give them a little bit coin. I give them 10 bucks and it becomes 20 and they're like, oh, it's, I did so good. I got the 20. I'm like, I gave you that to encourage you to buy more. When it becomes 20, you should put next to 10 in. You should see this as a positive thing and they don't connect the two. So I think there's a lot of people there like, I started too late. I can't catch up. It's never going to be me. And yeah, it's not going to be 1000% increases like, perhaps it was in the past. But, you know, double is good. You know, you have a hundred to get 200. It's pretty sweet. I mean, if it triples, I mean, and you don't have to do any work. You don't have to hold it. It's not physical. I mean, you could, you know, you go through the private custody thing like we discussed earlier. But, uh, no, it just seems like it's time. It's time for everyone to get just a little bit. A couple hundred bucks. Try the Bitcoin. And, uh, well, I won't predict the future and neither will the panel. We do have this plastic ball that will now Dan Eave predicting against the ball. Will the price of Bitcoin be higher or lower this time next week? Nay, higher. Victoria, higher or lower? Um, well, just to be contrarian and given all the controversy with the US election coming up, I'm going to say lower. No, it's higher, always higher. But here we go. What will the ball say? See if I have my flashlight sometime the ball can be hard to read. Um, will the price of Bitcoin be higher this time next week? You may rely on it. You may rely on it one of the strongest predictions from the magic capable. Uh, let's move on. We have a couple more stories. Mainly just some updates on previous stories. Peter Todd in wired magazine big time, uh, according to wired Peter Todd was unmatched as Bitcoin creator Satoshi Nakamoto. Now he's in hiding. But wait, according to coin desk, Peter Todd says even his reports of going into hiding are exaggerating. And he says even though he's hiding and avoiding the public eye, he's speaking at Bitcoin conferences. As James and Lops said, a rumor has it that he's in hiding, but you never know when you might run into the real Craig right. Uh, so I don't, I don't have much commentary on this. I mean, I'll go through the panel here. Uh, I think Peter probably should be in hiding. I like Peter. He's a nice guy. I don't want bad things to have into him. I think a lot of kind of create like he said, crazy people think he's Satoshi. Think he has lots of money. That could go badly. Dan Eve, what do you think should Peter go into hiding? Should he keep going to conferences? It's pretty clear choice. Well, I mean, I can understand where he's coming from, right? You know, the original Dorian, you know, got, got a lot of stick for, um, for, for, and got followed around a lot, right? When, when they first, and that was when Bitcoin was really largely unheard of when, when Dorian was outed as, as, uh, Satoshi Nakamoto, um, the recent that with, with pray, right, no, believe this, it's Satoshi. It's not about this like following him, apart from some people. So like, I don't know, he's lost a bunch of cases. So like, I think that, that, uh, that it's, you know, people don't really believe it's him. So he's not getting the harassment that someone that they truly actually believe would be, you know, Satoshi. Um, now I actually, uh, asked when, when that documentary came out, I went through, um, through a bunch. I went through chat GBT because, you know, it does, it does the research for you. And I said, based on all of the writings, um, of a bunch of people that, you know, if you were to assess the, you know, the ID elected the way they wrote the terminology they used the coding practices, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I fed it a few, a few names. I fed it like Adam back and I fed his, he had Todd and I fed it, um, um, uh, what's the name? Glen Sasserman and, uh, and Hal Finney and basically it said, I can't remember the exact conclusion. I'll see if I can find it. But it basically said like, everyone else pretty much know, like it's very obviously no, but Hal Finney, it kind of set that. I'll see if I can find it the conclusion by the end. It was, it was really interesting the conclusion it gave. Um, and so, uh, if, yeah, I don't think it's, I don't think it's Peter Todd. Um, um, because not just the fact that he was younger, but when it was, was made, but people when it came, you know, when it was released into some white papers release, et cetera. Um, but people have commented about the coding practices that we use, like the Hungarian notation that was that that's used in early Bitcoin, but by Satoshi. Um, that's more of an old school type of notation that say Peter Todd wouldn't be used to. He, you know, he, he, he, he, given his age, he would have used coding practices that were different to help to the ones Satoshi used. Um, so there's, there's a bunch of evidence against that. And I think that this documentary is largely meant to sensationalize the fact and just come up with someone, right. And it's much easier and much more sensational to come up with someone who's still alive and cause this controversy, even if you don't think it's actually true. And the, the clincher really didn't, didn't do it for me. Cause if you know Peter Todd, like move into you to a bunch of times and hung out with him and stuff in formal and informal ways. And, um, his character is, yeah, he's a, he's a contrarian. And he likes, he's kind of a bit, he's like sarcasm in the way. And so when you actually read the continuation of that sentence, you know, I read it like a hundred times over that, that, that peace again, the Satoshi and then the response from Peter. And it just seems like Peter Todd would normally kind of go, you know, dot, dot, dot, and blah, blah, blah. Like it, it wasn't seem like a continuation, but more like a correction in the normal way that he kind of, that he kind of do it. So that really wasn't a clincher for me. There was, there was some of the other stuff that you tried to put forward, but made you think, oh, maybe, yeah, maybe now, you know, but, um, yeah. It kind of, let's face it, it kind of leans towards how funny. Uh, like that's where most people's bet is, Len Sassamund obviously sounds like an interesting one. But then, you know, the fact that his wife is worried about, um, his, his widow's wife is very worried about her own safety now. Um, because if people start to think it's him and she thought that before the documentary came out, the prediction markets, even, I think we're swinging that way at one point. She was worrying about her safety because even if it's not some people that are trying to kidnap her or something like that, it's still people invading your space, asking a bunch of questions. I think in the article she even said these people like would arrogantly, like come to her and demand these, these questions to be answered about where it was, Len on this, this particular night and what was he doing? And no one wants that, especially from a relative that's passed on. So we can, we should just forget about who Satoshi is because we would have found out by now and equivitively. Like there's been 15 years of researchers and we still don't know. And there's a good reason why we don't know because Satoshi covered his tracks incredibly well. And we don't know. Maybe in the future, when we can break our same encryption and we've got quantum computers in hundreds of years that can do all this. Then maybe we'll find out because it can just basically read for the data and figure it out, but it's not something we need to be concerned about now. The interesting thing with how thin he is, I feel either he was Satoshi or he knew Satoshi because either way he's working on all these projects, he's on all the mailing list, he's everywhere, then Satoshi comes along and asks for help on the project. And it seems like how would already know that guy like you would already know Adam back or whoever it is and he'd say, of course I'm going to help you when in the other way if he didn't know him and this total new camera new comer comes in how would be like saying to Adam and he'd say to scab on all his other friends or whatever he'd say this newcomers using all your work. It seems a lot more like he's like, oh yeah, my buddy who I've known already is using all his work together to make this Bitcoin thing. So I found I found it right so what I did was I asked it to do breaking down so linguistic characteristics comparisons of Satoshi's writings, style of metric and for ends it comparison behavioral and contextual evidence and any other connections and it came up with it came up with the conclusion was how finisily elect tone and writing habits share several sites striking similarities with those of Satoshi, particularly in terms of politeness clarity, technical depth and humility. However, while there are overlap, finis health issues public denials and openness about his involvement in Bitcoin make it less likely that he was actually Satoshi. So yeah, so even chat GPC said well, there are similarities there's some of them are striking the way he was, you know, he's just verbiage the way because that's you know simulating someone's code right there's a bit black, there's a bit more black and white or a different style of code is probably a lot easier to do than emulate a completely different type of writing and and wording, especially in the early days of Bitcoin when there was a lot of two and fro having to on the flight without. Without a re-wording things for you and the technology to do so, you would have to think about every response that you wrote pretending to not write like how you would normally write the punctuation things like that the way you would spell capitalized words and and yeah, so it's basically said for all the other ones that put in the list it went nah, how finis striking similarities but now. Well, and that's that's another place where I'd like to poke holes in my own Satoshi theory I thought given that one line in the Satoshi where he says I don't have time to explain it to you know you have to figure out on your own I read that is incredibly sarcastic and I said well this Peter Todd guy that I know he's smart he's sarcastic he's in all the right places but there is a possibility now I want to just put in you know as a possibility that Satoshi was actually just well meaning. And he just was saying to that guy I don't have time to explain it to you if you can understand it I'm sorry and it wasn't this like sick burn as I'm reading it and it's very interesting how the different textual analysis of something and can lead you to say well it's a sick burn it must be Peter he's so sarcastic or at least he's doing the comms team I mean there could be many people working on this project we don't know. But to take it back another way and down another time Satoshi's just kindly saying to this guy I don't get it and let's move on I don't I don't know him or her or them or the space alien or whatever so I can't interpret that and that's what so funny about text communication we're never going to know with Satoshi incredibly sarcastic or where they just kind of you know maybe one of these autistic guys without the emotions and they're just like I don't have time to explain it to you on to next robotic topic I'm a robot. But let's go to Victoria Jones what do you think Peter is in hiding he's not in hiding and then he's at a conference again should he be doing this is this safe for our friend Peter. I think he's doing pretty good job of shaking off the accusations you know if you were Satoshi probably the best thing to do would be to keep going to conferences in order to demonstrate that you know he wasn't worried and he wasn't hiding out because of course you know he's now had several years of going to conferences. So you know he can kind of keep up that normality. So yeah I think the best thing I think anyone can do in that situation is just kind of carry on as normal and you know keep denying I think if everyone who suspected of Satoshi keeps denying it that seems to be working quite well at keeping all the suspicions at base so yeah keep going. Tonight tonight tonight that's what they always say and a couple more story updates according to the daily hodl Elon Musk's Tesla is still holding 772 million dollars in Bitcoin even after seven wallets have a massive coin shuffle. Last week we talked about the possibility of Tesla perhaps moving their Bitcoin to sell them it turns out they've moved them I don't know just for fun reasons and at least as far as we can tell they still control them. We also have a correction last week I talked about the Italian capital gains tax to 42% raising from 42% or from 26% to 42% and I made some mistakes in the article. It was a little unclear they said that the that they approved a tight budget funded by a levy on banks and insurers this combined with Maloney's quote here saying as we promised there will be no new taxes for citizens confused me and made me think that the raise was on businesses holding Bitcoin based on comments here from shout out to Jerome play act 2433. He questioned that and checked out some other articles and it seems like they actually are raising the tax on normal individual citizens from 26% capital gains to 42% I think this quote needs to be changed that it will not affect citizens who do not have more than $2,000 in cryptocurrency the rest will be affected so just wanted to correct this our goals always to give you accurate information if we make mistakes. We try to correct them when we can so let's move on to predictions or story of the week Dan Eve to have a prediction or a story of the week also welcome back to the show Dan how you doing it's good to see it good good yeah great thanks yeah thanks for much good good to be back I was I was battling some some some health stuff so actually with worth so money story of the week is probably a story of the last six months. But just want to warn you all because I reached 40 and it happened and I had high blood pressure and it creeps up and you wouldn't even know and like it's a silent killer. And so just just keep an eye if you know if you're a wage like me you know just just check it out because we know something we forget about and yeah so all all locked down now all health all good and on top of the world back again so yeah just look after yourselves folks because. Yeah things can get choppy I think one of the worst parts about aging that no one ever told you about is that they're going to start changing all the Facebook posts so they're all retro 80s and 90s movies on this day 34 years ago this movie that you remember came out on this day this movie came out and just as dancing they sometimes put an even worse twist on it where they say something like if you recognize this toy or if you know this computer connector. You might need a colonoscopy like don't say that don't do that but as Dan saying you should take care of yourself and get those colonoscopies they're not that scary and it's very healthy it's very healthy for you to extend your life. Victoria Jones do you have a prediction story the week hopefully not health problem related. Well my prediction for this week is that with the American elections coming up it's going to get a bit crazy over in America so I'm glad I live in Britain right now. Oh it's so crazy I'm in a swing state so it's totally different than it was previous and every advertisement is a horrible political ad and even if perhaps you supported the candidate you might look at the advertisement say did they really have to hit that load they really have to say that they have to use that clip and they're all negative I mean I think common might have some positive ones but most of the ones we see here are basically Trump ads going after his opponents in the most negative way imaginable sometimes almost humorously almost to the point of madness but then again if you're banging the drum you're like I agree with this madness so anyway I'm not supposed to talk about it let's keep moving or at the end of the show I'll have to see how that turns out in America. Where I also live. Oh good. So thanks to everybody for joining us thanks for all the comments from last week even if it's a correction and we make a mistake I still appreciate the comments. 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