The Bitcoin Group, the American original. For over the last 10 seconds, the sharpest satosis, the best bitcoins, the hardest crypto currency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists. Dan Eave, the crypto raptor. And all Bitcoin's. And I'm Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network. Still not sure that this is working. It's looking to me like we're broadcasting a black screen. Can anyone confirm that we're working and not having technical? Oh, there it is. Oh, it looks fine. Everything's fine. Moving on to issue one. Issue one. Bitcoin in stasis. Low 27k. Ahead of Powell's speech. US Federal Reserve chairman Jerome Powell will speak late Friday morning. At the perspectives on monetary policy panel before the Thomas Laubach Research Committee. Everyone will be looking at what Powell says, trying to find out if he's going to raise or lower interest rates and how then this could affect Bitcoin. Dan Eave, what do you think about the price of Bitcoin? Everyone's just waiting to see what the Federal Reserve does. Yeah, I don't know, man. Like it's obviously it may have a slight impact, but I don't know. I think the politics doesn't really hit the same way as it used to be. Like, you know, back in the day, especially when it was something like China's thinking of banning Bitcoin. And then it was like everything would fall correct. And then it would be like China's not banning it for the reconsidering and then everything will pump again. It kind of it hasn't it doesn't really follow that same kind of pattern it used to where the news would really have such a significant. Such a significant impact on the price of Bitcoin. But ultimately the hash rate, the things that are really matter like the hash rate for example, is still 350 something exerhashes, which is still like within about 10% of all time high. And the difficulty is at all time high, 49.55 trillion. And we know from covering various mining sort of articles, the mining industry just keeps on, keeps on growing, especially now that we're in this, we're seems to be at the end of the, the, the bear crypto Bitcoin winter and starting to kind of, we're in that run up within one year right now of the harming so things are starting to kind of perk up a bit. They're going to still be up and down, it's still going to be turbulent. But ultimately the infrastructure keeps on building the things keep on building. So that's kind of what I rate Bitcoin and the users as well, the number of users, the number of wallets or addresses with holding Bitcoin grows. So those are really the right fundamentals. The price just kind of follows everything else. So yeah, I think it's, it's lovely looking to the price. It's nice seeing a bit of pump. It always makes me a bit sad seeing a bit of a dump. But at the same time, I know that it's really, you know, it's really just means nothing in the whole grand scheme of things because Bitcoin is building. Well, I do think everyone's waiting to see if the Federal Reserve will finally stop raising rates, allowing the stock market to go up and then as we've seen Bitcoin to follow it up. For me, the Bitcoin price this week is more about the fear of the Republicans not raising the debt ceiling in the United States, which would cause the United States to default on its debt, causing a worldwide crisis. Hopefully they can save that off with negotiations or possibly the 14th amendment, saying that the United States cannot default on its debt. But the idea of a major government in the world defaulting on its debt publicly seems like the kind of crisis that Bitcoin's made for, which surprisingly might cause Bitcoin to go up. So it's just you predicting against the magic Bitcoin ball, the source of all truth and knowledge in the universe. I know you've had a lot of success lately. So here it goes. Will the price of Bitcoin be higher or lower this time next week? Well, surprisingly, I was actually, I think I said up last time and it did go, it seems like it has gone up, which is a really, really rare thing because I'm usually terribly wrong about these things. I'm going to say up again and see if I can be right twice in which is a record for me twice in a row. Well, I'm always bullish. I never understand why Bitcoin goes down, but they tell me it has to. So let's see what the ball thinks. Will the price of Bitcoin be higher this time next week? It's very dark in here. The ball says, better not tell you now. The ball does not answer sneaky. Moving on to issue two, the MPs are right. Bitcoin is just gambling and should be treated as such an interesting view from the United Kingdom from the evening standard, which I thought was a newspaper, but maybe it's just a tabloid. They're talking about how the UK should not get into Bitcoin. They should ignore this technology and treat it like gambling. They say that Bitcoin and crypto has no intrinsic value, huge price volatility, and no discernible social good. In other words, it's like a William Hill shop and should be treated as such. We can leave the global crypto tech hub to somewhere else. Thomas Hunt, what do you think of this dramatic view from the United Kingdom? Well, obviously I'm surprised that a country has been so wrecked by Brexit would want to close the door on another set of ideas. I think it's hilarious to see Bitcoin described as only gambling for so long. We knew that it was much more than that. You could use it to buy drugs on the Silk Road. You could use it for money laundering and tax evasion. And now they tell me that it's only gambling. When in reality, we know that it's this incredible technology that allows you to do so many things and more with the lightning network now with ordnals, with stamps, with liquid, with liquid NFTs, with so many other options, multi signature technologies. It's so much more than gambling. It's a full fledged financial revolution, but this writer in the UK is not interested in that revolution and would have rather have the United Kingdom stay home. Dan, what do you think of your fellow countrymen here and his dislike for that dirty gambling Bitcoin? Well, it's, I mean, you know, obviously that the report was was pretty ridiculous in itself saying it pretty much said that right. It's that the it's only used for like drugs and kidnapping and extortion and stuff like that, which is obviously it's obviously ludicrous. The article itself, I mean, you just, I don't know how anyone could like read this and and and consume it as actual news. It's like it's just another version of old man moaning with vague references, what an old man, but you know, I'm just thinking of the meme, you know, old man yelling in sky. But it's just a dude with, you know, moaning with vague references to an actual news article, you know, the whole thing's just so incredibly biased. I remember back in my day when people read the news and like they read it without like going and so and so blah blah blah and it's just the whole article just it just smacks like I mean, yeah, how can you take anything seriously. And you know, and this is a financial element of the evening standard, bro. I'm barely in my Bitcoin has been around now what 13 the over 13 years it's not something is over 13 years. Yeah, this is not so yeah, it's not something that's just like popped up and you know it's not 10 years ago when this thing, you know, we were still kind of assessing whether it's you know whether whether it's a viable, you know alternative to money. It's the like the most uptime in any network right it's the most secure network like to say these things have no intrinsic values is obviously ludicrous because not even say Google have an uptime of 99.9% of all the biggest tech giants on earth. But when there's lines like there were wines from today from predictable quarters, folk with job titles like crypto and digital assets technical director. I mean, you could you just know the person to try who's right. It's me honest right. And even just like saying like making out as like as if they would even know what Bitcoin is you know what the reason why Bitcoin is here and reason and and what underpins it how it gets his value like people using it, for example, that you know, met cars, Lord, all that. But they say, oh, it's a spec, they say it's a speculative dot com stock like a company that has no revenue. And it's like how can you insult something where you don't even understand it is like I just think that's laughable when anyone who's reading this with any with any shred of like of brain would be thinking, maybe like this guy's got such a bias, maybe he actually doesn't know what he's he's talking about and he doesn't appear to nobody's talking about in the article. He just sort of and tries to mock Bitcoin like he also mentions about it was saying that people were people were annoyed because they think Bitcoin's going to save well, well, that's not really true. That Bitcoin's about a form of money and they don't trust like basically twice like him that are running financial systems right now because of the issues that we had in the past, like you can't you can't trust banks, you can't trust you, you can was we see in the US recently you can't trust the banks, you know, that they're with with the recent values that now more financially than 2008, I mean obviously that doesn't I don't think that that's adjusted for inflation, which is obvious, which it hasn't been in just for inflation, which is again, inflation, the reason why Bitcoin's here because money's printed out of thin air and it's devaluing your currency again, you know, if you're if you're going to just mock something that you don't understand, at least like try and like who can don't know cares about a counter argument, but actually give reasons against it rather than just going rabble, rabble used for pillaging and stuff like that, har har stupid crypto bros or whatever they do usually right and do this sexist kind of crypto bros, you know, the sort of thing or whatever it is, but yeah, just it's just Cont wallet basically, it's a nice old fashioned English word, cons wallet for a cons wallet article. It is pretty bad, like you said, Dan, it reminds me a lot of the old man yelling at the sky meme, grandpa Simpson out there and it also reminds me of Warren Buffett the way that he just doesn't seem to understand Bitcoin internet internet companies and technology and I hope, you know, when I get older that the things that I don't understand, I won't go out there and opine about you kids and you're rock and roll music, it sounds just like that saying that Bitcoin's only for gay people. And you know, the UK is supposed to be the financial capital of the world. Good luck with that if you're just going to treat Bitcoin like gambling, I was reminded a lot of the serenity prayer. So I went ahead looked it up here, it says God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference. It seems like this author is running against things that he cannot change things that he does not understand and just kind of making a fool of himself incidentally enough here, it says that Ryan whole neighbor wrote the serenity prayer who also wrote that famous poem of, you know, when they were they came for the church makers and they, you know, they didn't come for me. But you know, they first they came for so and so and then they came. Yeah, yeah, and they didn't come for me and then at the end, you know, they come for him. So quite a powerful words and something that maybe the author should take to understand when he doesn't understand new technology, you can't just put in a box like this is just for gambling, this is just for drug money, this is just for these things because when you look at money broader, we come back and I always hear those Andreas words, you know, haunting you. If if your money can't buy drugs and prostitution, what good is your money? I mean, he's absolutely right like money buys stuff like US dollars, whether we like it or not are used in palettefuls in like Iraq and other countries to bribe warlords to bribe dictators like $20 bills are often used to bribe anyone across the world. And makes it valuable that makes it useful as a Danny DeVito said in the fantastic David Mammoth film heist that's why they call it money. The stuff that everyone wants it's called money. So, so the so obviously I went slightly I actually did a bit of an ad hominem against them, which is bad because that's always like the lowest form of debate, right? So I feel like I feel like a twat for calling someone a twat and I apologize, not that he'd be listening because he hates Bitcoin obviously. So, okay, but anyway, sorry. Tony of the article is much more farce call an opinion related, you know, perhaps we're reading it as, but yes, it was a huge. He's nervous humorous take let us know in the chat. What do you think is Bitcoin only gambling? Should you go down to a slot parlor and you know put your money in a Bitcoin ATM and then get the same feeling as a slot machine? I'm not sure it's going to do that for you. Well, one thing is though that I you can guarantee and I did you do. So in the UK, I'm not sure what it's like in US, but gambling has no tax on gains. And I know for well that if they say, oh, it's gambling and put all the regulatory framework around Bitcoin as they would for gambling, they're still going to tax you for the gains. It's going to be the best of both worlds whilst being utter morons and stifling a new technology, which is clearly growing is not going anywhere is unstoppable. And so just it's just ludicrous. You know, as you're saying, there's obviously issues after we've done Brexit with with the with the economy. So why would it go and like drive businesses elsewhere? Like we used to say we they say they now are distancing myself and there's more from more from that layer. And I've got a surprise and not too don't get too excited. But anyway, distancing myself from England and it's crazy ridiculous ideas that Bitcoin is just for gambling who will then taxi on your gambling gains as well. So yeah, that that's going to suck. I know they'll end up doing that right. It will be the best of both worlds. They'll be able to regulate it hardcore and then also make sure that you're giving the money for being idiots and making bad policies and stifling innovation shame on you shame on you. I don't know. I think the article should have led with the no tax thing Bitcoin is like gambling and we don't want to tax your gains crypto currency lovers come to the United Kingdom where we have backwards laws that will treat Bitcoin like gambling and let you have untouched gains. You got to look at the bright side right there's always a silver lining. The fact that the article like that's so crucial I think to anyone covering this article that's one of the most crucial things you're talking about how it's going to be regulated in future then say something that's actually like meaningful about it. Just like waffle in thin air like saying oh obviously you know gambling games on tax you know what the implications of that will it drive people to the country will it drive them out will it drive more Bitcoin grows there and blah blah blah and go down that route but it's just the whole thing is just it is it's just it's just it's just dribble it's just like the worst of all the other articles that just Bitcoin put together the only thing I think it's missing the only thing it's missing is moaning about Bitcoin boiling whales in the environment and the energy uses otherwise it would have been a you know what's it been go full house or whatever it is it would have been a bingo like line of of waffle. Well I think the problem is once you throw in the tax issue and you start thinking about this seriously you're like are we going to allow whole companies to come into the United Kingdom and set up and you know they look like tech firms like coin base their fin tech right we're going to like your gambling company you're dirty you know what are we what are they thinking about you know trying to spread the future of their country trying to survive just seems like a bad idea. We better move on to the next issue check out world crypto network dot com where we've got the brand new calendar there are 366 days on which we've made a video here at the world crypto network combined with mad bitcoins you can scroll through them all and click on a day and see how many videos we made in each year as well as see all the videos for free at world world crypto network dot com and mad bitcoins dot com issue three tether buys back Bitcoin with a portion of its net profit tether said that it would invest 15% of its net profit into Bitcoin to diversify the reserves that back its USD T token which aims to stick to a one to one peg to the US dollar that would amount to roughly 222 million dollars based on the company's latest report which said the company generates 1.48 billion dollars in net profit Dan Eve what do you think about tether buying in to Bitcoin well I mean it's a good sign that there are 220 millions not a small chunk of small chunk of money and whatever you think of their operations and the fact that it is a you know you did well it's not a utility token it's meant to be a stable coin right it hasn't actually deep paced like any of the others have not as bad as say what happened to usdc and died but ultimately it's something that has a lot of use as much as people don't like the idea of selling Bitcoin lots of people use it for scaling out Bitcoin whether they just want to day trade if that's their thing and they want to do it their entire time to do it's free market and or whether they're trying to hold Bitcoin as their savings and they have a big expense coming up so if they think there's going to be a bit of a downturn they'll trade out into tether just to freeze that money so that they can use it for whatever expenses so it does have a use and ultimately it's the highest performance wrong word but it's got the highest volume traded of all currencies and that's consistently right it's still you know Bitcoin right now is 11.9 billion dollars and tether is 18 when we last talked about it's 28 billion dollars of trading and it's about 17 18 of Bitcoin so it's consistently the most traded asset and I think actually if you take the trading volume of tether and it's probably more than all of the other coins combined and that's including actually USDC which is about 2.6 billion of volume and buy and add BUSD 1.9 so it's about 2.9 billion dollars it's a very significant chunk of the trading volume obviously you people use it now as a gateway to get into into other things and back in the day it was you had to buy Bitcoin everything the index was Bitcoin right you know Bittreks minimum how all of those they didn't have a stable coin that you could use you would have to go from Bitcoin into whatever shit coin you wanted to or you would pay a huge premium to go from Bitcoin to sell it out into fear money or is at least this gives you the ability to to hedge out and in as you see fit and actually have you know a much better spread. So yeah it has a use the fact that it says that the articles to stable coins were already a hot button issue for regulators who have been scrambling to figure out how to keep the industry in check after the demise of several notable firms in the space. They never seem to mention about the scrambling to figure out how to keep the industry in check for like the banks that have just gone down in the US like it's it's a you know there's there's there's the reason why the traditional system is is so fallible and that's because you know if you're saying the crypto isn't regulated enough then I know for sure that the banking industry is very clear the banking industry isn't regulated enough because the banking industry is a very evolved industry. And when you've got big players that are falling and multiple of them in the same year in a probably quickest succession actually then then the failures we've seen you know if you spread see the spread from UST and terror and to FTX so I think it's all a bit crazy. But anything you can say about crypto being a not a Bitcoin being not regulated as much as it should be you know applies 10 fold to the traditional banking system. But one thing is funny in the FTX news I don't know if you've seen is that FTX is now suing Sam Bankman free. I think for hundreds of millions of dollars or something like that so yeah that that that's just the gift that keeps on giving it that the old FTX tail. It's the best but going back to tether and Bitcoin I think that this is it's good for Bitcoin and it's good for tether but I'm not crazy about how tether got the money it seemed to me if you go back in time tether said they had US dollars in an account equal to the number of tether that there were being printed. But in actuality tether took that money in the account and used it to bet on Bitcoin now sure they happen to bet on Bitcoin at a fantastic time at an all time low at a great moment that got them swept up to where now they have more money than they should. And they don't know what to do with it so again they're going to put it into Bitcoin hopefully it works out for them and it's great and everything but it's another example of once you give someone your money like Dan said with S.B.X. And FTX they can do what they want with it whether your money is Bitcoin or altcoin or dollars or whatever you put it in their account you expect FTX to have separate accounts you expect tether to not go gambling with the money but it always seems to happen you just can't trusting third parties is consistently a mistake whether it's computing or money or Bitcoin or whatever and the problem with this is that you can't do it. But the problem with this is it just might work tether invested wisely in Bitcoin last time they might invest wisely in Bitcoin this time there may never be a problem because they win their bets but if they lose their bets watch out. It's definitely it seems like it's a good time to be to be edging in we're probably due another another little dump like at some point right you know it's that's just what happens on the on the run up to a ball run but if they they hold until post ball run then they're probably going to be doing pretty good and you know 1.8 billion dollars of profit in per quarter I mean that's that's pretty incredible like that's huge huge profit. And I think that obviously they get a lot of flack from about the they try and be you know public and say they're audited but obviously you know that relies on a third party where you know you can't see the where the money is exactly and although they're they're audited as Josh pointed out last week there's still the ability for them to have contracts that they're essentially load out the money or in the loan up money but you know the money is not going to be a good time. It's essentially someone else's but it's contractually there's so there's kind of things that go behind the scenes where you know there still could be a reduced reduced trust but ultimately it's a company that makes a lot of money if they're buying lots of Bitcoin I think it's also a very good thing I think it's like 2% of their assets that are currently held in Bitcoin now. They are a very big player in the game in terms of holding the coin sorry dogs is he doesn't like teller tell us okay. Well you know the famous expression they close the barn door now that all the horses have gone and it's great for tether to be audited now it's great to have it in accounts now after you've taken customer funds and made a giant bet on Bitcoin like a roulette wheel. We talked about gambling before they won their bet and now as far as I know after you make a big bet and win it you don't really need to make another big bet they can kind of keep coasting on what they have and this investment at Bitcoin seems to be part of that coast. So I think it's going to work out for them I'm positive moving on to issue 4. Is ledger's new Bitcoin key recovery features safe experts have doubts. The French wallet maker believes the service will help attract customers turned off by cryptos unforgiving self custody ethos but critics wonder whether the concept is compatible with a real hardware wallet. What about ledgers new Bitcoin recovery feature Thomas hunt. Well we've talked about hardware wallets on the show a lot and usually we talk about trezzer we always mention ledger sometimes maybe block stream Jade or cold card one of the other options I forget them all apologies if I forgot your one but ledgers always had a problem it's never been open source and that's always led to a default. You're trusting the company which was partially funded by some French government grants to hold your keys and to not expose them right but if it's not open source you can't really check it. I was pretty disturbed by the reply by Thomas from ledger he's a classic old school Bitcoin Bitcoin or so respect to him of course but he says so people started to think ledger was a trustless solution which is not the case. Some amount of trust must be placed into leisure to you ledger to use the product if you don't trust ledger meaning you treat your hardware manufacturer as an adversary that can't work at all. And while I do agree with some of what he's saying I do have to trust someone like ledger or trezzer to make the device to uphold the security standards and do the best they can with the device if they're designing features that allow you to recover your keys as many people have said on the show. The internet it's only one more loop for a hacker to run that feature you can once you start having that feature you make it easier for the hacker to run that feature make it easier for your key to be backed up maybe on ledger server I think that a similar problem with their mailing list the ledger mailing list was hacked because it was on a marketing server and it wasn't guarded well which was a big problem because these are all customers of a hardware wallet company implying they have Bitcoin. It's a little bigger than just a marketing problem and for them to not see that or not to see this as the huge problem it is I don't have a great deal of trust in the ledger company obviously you can make your own choices when it comes to hardware wallets I still think trezzer maybe block steam Jade although Jade had the same thing where it has weird stuff like a Bluetooth feature and a wireless feature or something and I'm like less less features more hardware wallets but I guess I'm one of those. In tractable crypto hold your own keys people that surprisingly Thomas from ledger is speaking against almost like Elon Musk going after the laptop class Dan Eve what do you think of ledger's latest feature recovery keys. It's an interesting point that is the only part I agree with that he says that you know you still have to it's not even it's not entirely trustless right but but most people like 99.99% of people even you know who use open source as much as possible this they're still trusting in a number of things like if you're interacting with a MacBook you are trusting an apple that they don't have something that intercepts. The whatever is there's being run the same windows the down to the very chip that you know the CPU that's running whatever it is you're trusting that that doesn't have something built in that you know that has some sort of back door so we are unfortunately unless you build everything from scratch now exactly how everything works and then and that's it down to the fabrication process you're trusting even there was an open source chip right you're trusting that in the fabrication process of that chip that nothing. Nothing else happened so it's there's always some element of trust that's the only part of people I like the way I like the way he kind of almost thought it was a got not a gotcha but like a he is one of his retores he was like basically you know we've always been able to do it so they then delete that we pretty quickly but that you know the fact is that even if it's opt in and even if you had to you're fully aware of it and you had to do it. So you know it's just to choose the firmware to be upgraded and know that they're introducing this feature and that you would be opting in the back doors already there like that there's the back door it it's it's you know it goes against what they said their own tweets is as a you know where they said a firmware update can't extract the private keys from the secure element which is obviously you know which was actually BS now well they also says the I like when they say during the recovery process as it's not the private key itself that's getting extracted but the seed phrase encoding it but I mean just think about that what does the seed phrase give you access to all the private keys like that's the whole point of it so like that's not even a like a defense point that's just a ridiculous and they say all encryption fragmentation and decryption of your secret recovery phrase happens on your ledger on the secure element so the only thing that leave the only thing that leaves is the secure element chip so is the and after your consent of the encrypted charts so what leaves is your seed phrase whether or not it's encrypted and whether whoever is still your see phrase still leaves like it means that they the seed doesn't stay on your device that was the whole kind of point of it right yeah so yeah so the thing is like oh fun fun fact you know we've always been able to take it it's actually done by Shemeer secrets they say which actually well I was looking into this because I switched from ledger to to treason and and along long long over to just partly me just because of laziness but that did a really good a glad cost from from Castilla from the Bitcoin takeover podcast did a really good video actually explaining Shemeer secrets so you should go like YouTube but check that out on YouTube if you want an explanation of how that works. I think ultimately it's I think like as much as this I think it's a kind of good idea but not in any way that they execute it if they did like a separate device which it wasn't relevant to the old devices they did a separate device and you know as they kind of describe it the mum and dad device or however they sort of phrase it but like it's the halfway house right it's like you know people who don't want to store their keys because they don't trust themselves to store this phrase they and they're holding on an exchange at least they're using a hardware device at least they're using a hardware device and they're opting in and it's a specific one and not the actual ledger and they're you know when you buy it you know this then that's a different story to just rolling out to every ledger and being like oh cool we could have we could have got your keys at any time anywhere I mean that's just it's just totally messed up it's really displayed to their trust I think people are going to move more much more quicker now to like open source devices like like like president like like Jay blockchain stage so I think that that's kind of a good thing it gets people more involved in the open source site but yeah after you know ledges data breach I don't think as you mentioned it wasn't don't think it was specifically ledger but it was like the male chimp or whatever service that they were using where they the mailing this went you know that's a big thing you've already missed people's trust and so that was an example of a failure in strategic thinking where the mailing list was far more valuable than they thought it was they thought it was something marketing guy go set it up you know put your password on doesn't matter if you have to a fa doesn't matter for using a secure service or maybe male chimp got hacked whatever it was that list was far too valuable and it was treated casually and without care and then once it's leaked I mean I Dan I think you're on the ledger list I think people could look you up and other of our friends on that list and you get phone calls and hackers and emails and fishing emails and sure you know we all want to be smart people we say I'm not going to fall for that you know I'm above that but out there there are some people that will fall for it and they don't need to be exposed to it and they're being exposed to it because this leak this list was undervalued in the same way when I when I read this article and I hear about what ledger's doing like Dan says maybe they should have a hardware device for mom and dad the easy hardware device but why does it have to be a false promise then because what good is a hardware device how is the mom and dad hardware device better than coin base. It's not I mean it's still just trusting a third party maybe it's trusting a third party and now you have to find a physical device so it's even worse it's like coin base but you have to find your your ledger or you don't get your money back so it doesn't seem to deliver what the other hardware wallets deliver and I know it's difficult but writing down that the 24 word seed phrase especially writing it down twice having two copies and your treasurer or your Jade or whatever you like. That's pretty clever like that's not that difficult once people have done that they have a real hardware wallet they can really hold their own funds and the simplest thing for them to then do is they should just have a web page where they say here's how you get a safety deposit box in your country and they should say what again I love quote again. I wish he was here but he would say over and over again how we have thousands of years of physical security we know all about vaults and security guards and you know checklists and all these things that will essentially keep your safe deposit box safe you could also get two or three safe deposit boxes you could get two or three Jade wallets or treasures or ledgers or whatever you put one in each one you'd have so much more security for mom and dad then this fake hardware device. I don't feel that ledgers actually delivering the mom and dad product and they're not delivering them the actual security that a cold wallet has I mean yes you have the possibility of losing it but that's what makes it secure I mean you can't get rid of the losing and keep the security and I think we're going to do this over and over again I'm sure that Jack from Twitter is probably developing a similar wallet but the only other thing I had it seems like a pathway for the wallet to be hacked. As well once you have this recovery feature and you know that the firmware can get to the key will now hackers know exactly what to target what kind of malware or virus to get onto that ledger and if you look at the recent news you know last password was hacked because one of their administrators installed plex onto his work laptop. Say what you will you could have just bought a second laptop used it only for plex and video and whatever else never used your work laptop for something else and what you trust when the guy says yes you have to have trust in your hardware wallet company I trust the developers to be paranoid I trust them to be like those Bitcoin developers were like we can't raise the block limit because it makes it bloated and it makes it weaker and it makes it less secure and like they said in reservoir dogs you know I'm a professor. I'm a professional here you know I tell you my name it gets out it gets one step closer to me and that can't happen those are the developers that I want working on my hardware wallet and I don't see that here at ledger with this the feature the direction like Dan says forcing your existing class of people who have bought a different product to upgrade to the new mom and dad friendly product and we even have a little bit of humor here to end out this issue. This guy says the new firmware update with a much smoother UX and it says log into Facebook has the familiar blue button. Dan do you have any more on this issue. No, no, I mean I do think that it's still better than holding your keys on an on an exchange because you still you know an exchange could go down and you lose everything like for stop this there's no guarantees there you could lose all of your Bitcoin. So and obviously the exchange your own profile on the exchange could be hacked. But this I do think that like you know there is a slight use for it again only for a completely separate device where people don't want people don't want the idea of having to go and have a safe. But probably the of all the people have introduced a Bitcoin I reckon like none of them are storing their seed in a safe moment I'm not because I do it in a different way but it's still a kind of halfway house I think between storing your keys on an exchange and storing them on the on the hardware wallet is just done in a ridiculous way that's made everyone lose trust and the the guy from ledger the CEO founder whatever said that. Yeah, but this is looking to the future when you know when when we can roll out to the to the next wave of people who aren't so crypto savvy. But the point is that everyone who's got one now is you know the vast majority of them are pretty savvy when it comes to knowing that you know if you store your you lose your seed you lose it forever so you're you're changing your device to suit a market of people who are. People who aren't even mostly in Bitcoin yet and you're screwing over the existing user base by making them lose trust in you so just seems so a re odd approach that's for sure maybe a separate device I could I could imagine that but basically saying yeah well you know struggling it off with what we could have always extracted your keys and while we do extract them we extract them in three different parts you know and it only gives us your seed phrase which gives us every single private key you have. So it's just the whole thing is just one big PR nightmare but we're interesting to see if there's a max a mass Exodus to sito she laps and and and and block streams jade and and all the other hardware what is called called card and all that. It does seem like quite a mistake to change the firmware of the old customers wallets who thought they bought a real hardware wallet again I think it comes down to this basic idea that a true hardware wallet includes an element of danger and that there's no way to separate the danger from the security the danger and the security are the same the user and again there's ways to do this you can buy five hardware wallets and put you know 10. 10% of your money into each one you can buy three different safe deposit box at different banks there's many options where you could properly secure these things and not have to worry as much but if you include things like this recovery key if you have things I don't like like Wi-Fi access or or Bluetooth access to your hardware wallet you're just adding more ways for it to get hacked and when it does get hacked you'll unravel where the hack came from and it'll be a great deal. It'll probably be one of these obvious ways like they use the recovery feature so we're running out of time we're going to move on to the next issue issue five attendance at the world's largest Bitcoin conference down by half as crypto winter drags on roughly 15,000 attendees are expected at the Bitcoin 2023 event versus 35,000 last year likely as a downturn known as crypto winter. Robert F Kennedy junior the US presidential candidate is among scheduled speakers as we can see here from a picture and of course it's just a random photo so it could show anything that does seem to be less people I don't see a giant volcano in the center with a really cool news desk made out of a minor looks like they have a stack of tables over there if they still have the minor that's awesome but that was a beautiful desk and it was a beautiful volcano. But yes, it does look like kind of a down year for the conference I didn't make it out this year shout out to martin and general bites who are representing at the Miami Bitcoin conference Dan Eve what do you think about the Miami conference a little down this year and some interesting speakers. So it's only natural isn't it that in a in a not you know in a not all time high for a phase that or near all time high phase that the numbers will be down and that he has coin desk said that they're down about 25% on their blockchain week or whatever it was the coin desk sort of event so that's probably going to be the same kind of across the board. It does sound like they've got there there's another interesting set of characters going down that one that's already ruffled like a bunch of feathers is is bit boy I think stacey her but it's already trying to get him kicked out because he assaulted her by the sounds of it although I don't think he asked so it sounds like he insult her because he called her a bitch or something but it doesn't sound like physically assaulted as a verbal assault but either way lots of controversy. So it seems it seems there and I like that the are the articles said gathering typically provide a critical source of a so crucial critical is a bit critical is a bit too far up in the in the priorities gather this typically provide a crucial source of networking and in real life person interaction personal interaction because they know that most Bitcoin is literally just either like sitting the same chair all day looking looking at the price going up and down. Or they sit in a basement coding something call generally whatever it is it's in a cold dark room because they don't want to like a for heating because unless they have a minor that's doing the heating for them because otherwise they could be buying more Bitcoin with that money that went on heating or whatever else it was so I think ultimately any with anywhere that does a conference is going to be down hopefully. The me orca blockchain days which is coming up in July or August or which time going to go and the that that's going to be hopefully quite me orca blockchain. I can't remember what day is this time it's on the day is July 30th of July 2023 13th to 16th hopefully that's not going to be down because that's a really good conference and much better than the other ones there we go with me orca blockchain days. But yeah i'm not going to lie I'd I'd kind of like to be in Miami right now hanging out with my team and and you if you were there obviously Thomas and Ben because it seems like there's lots of nots to stuff and lots of Ellen bit stuff lots of Ellen this stuff there but no Ben so at least he's kind of there in is there in code and spirit by the sounds of it. But it sounds like he would have got a lot bigger workshop again even the last year like the workshops were huge for him last year and and I think a lot of people want to learn about about Ellen bits and learn about nostto so yeah there's definitely a lot to catch up on if you're watching the conference online but yeah i'm jealous i'm not i'm not there to be honest in Miami yeah i'm pretty i'm pretty disappointed they didn't include Ben and that even though I know Ben is trying not to travel and he's trying to have less of a schedule. They should have went out of their way to get Ben to go there if they had to buy him a plane or stick him some bitcoin under his pillows ben has done so much with noster so much with Ellen bit so much with the physical devices and i don't i don't want to get mad at the kid or whatever i'm sure the guy who's presenting Ellen bits was doing a good job and is on the team like everybody else in the noster people i'm sure they were all great. But i'm looking at his slides and his slides are like Ben's hardware device Ben's hardware device another Ben hardware device and there's next slide is like all these things you can do Ellen bits in the middle and then all the other side and i'm just like this is Ben Ben Ben Ben wears Ben and it's just a shout out to the amazing work he's done in the last few years that you know he's transformed the the open source desk at that conference it's now a whole stage there's all kinds of speakers they're talking about nostto. But i do also want to warn about the attendees at this event it's interesting Dan had the bit boy story i hadn't heard that yet that's interesting to me. Quite a character there as well but the one i'm the one i'm concerned about i'm going to go out on a political limb here is a rfk junior the presidential candidate rfk junior was a fantastic environmentalist but i want to warn you that he was an anti vaccine crusader before the covid vaccine so back when Jenny McCarty. Was saying the vaccines gave her children AIDS or sorry gave her children autism i fucked it up it's a it's a word one off autism autism not AIDS my bad but yes vaccines are bad Jenny McCarthy and rfk junior we're standing up against vaccines so i just worry about the bit corners when it comes to the new people that come in and the instant hero worship and the complete abandonment of any background checks that we tend to do if you look at the world of the world. If you look at Michael sailor he was quite the party boy back in his early dot com days you can look that up i don't think anyone has and it's shocking. Uh bukele is obviously a dictator and very powerful i don't want to insult him but he's a you know he's done some things you can look him up you could background check these guys before we say hey this guy is my new hero and he's the standard bearer of all Bitcoin and i hope he becomes president we could look at the background not just the light. Not just the last couple years not just the speech they make today but the speeches they made on other days so i worry about kind of the the ease of of grew worship there so what do you think i always I messed up the autism word that was that was a bit. That was quite interesting but I just went and checked i checked a site that I used to check out quite often it actually hasn't been looks like it hasn't been updated since 2015 but it's called the Jenny McCarthy body count dot com and like it's it's a count of. Of all the preventable illnesses that would have been if it wasn't for not show how the methodology have had they come up with this but they've got preventable illnesses and preventable deaths and stuff you know you can share a screen if you want to. I've got loads of loads of. I actually have a share my screen just go to Jenny just google it Jenny McCarthy body count not got that makes it sound like I was looking at porn or something not not in any way i've just got a very messy desktop it's like no one wants to see your messy room right when. So that's why it is unfortunate when people take these anti scientific things and they say oh my cousin heard this and oh I I feel this and it's not backed up by a scientific study with a thousand participants in a you know a survey and all these kind of things it does kind of. You know have this unfortunate result where you know Jenny goes out there and she means the right thing and i'm sure that rfk junior means the right thing as well but it's almost like a religious conversion for these people previously rfk junior was just one of the most impressive environmental lawyers and had an incredible argument for why we should protect the environment and if that's all he done and if that's what he was running on I'd be an unbelievable supporter of him as I think the entire democratic party. But unfortunately if you look back at his history he very much led this early anti vaccine movement which in many ways led to the larger COVID anti vaccine movement which has led to the disease conquering humanity and becoming endemic. So we're going to have covid shots every year like the flu and it's always going to be a part of our society and yeah to see these vaccine preventable deaths preventable other things because of so called mercury in the vaccine or. Heavy metals or causes autism or whatever it was which is just not scientifically backed it's just scientifically it doesn't prove out like I it's fun when we have a government conspiracy or whatever and we all get excited but if you do the actual studies and that's why if you read the actual Wikipedia page of rfk junior it's all about how these non scientifically back studies and that he's linked up with this other vaccine denier who also believed that he's not going to be a real advocate. He also believes in non scientifically back study the series of evidence collapses and I fear you know as we've said you know sailor bukely rfk the standard guy safety any of these bitcoins there's just not really any attempt to background check them they come in and we say they're heroes and then their worshiped and then later on we find out they're like Sam Bankman freed with FTX you know we had that guy the hard hitting news reporter was like oh you still drive a civics. And you're going to give all your money away with effective altruism and meanwhile anybody could have gotten us on the inside there and said hey he's he's living in a giant penthouse with his buddies and they're all banging each other and doing wake up drugs and they you know we just just doesn't seem normal kind of fintech dot com situation like kind of seems like some red flags. But instead everybody was waving the green flags they're saying hey come on in Sam you know we love we love what you do so. Now I've just realized as well I'm actually wearing the New York of blockchain I forgot the New York of blockchain days t-shirt so check it out even if you come just to get this amazing t-shirt and be honest there's actually another site called what's the harm dot net and it's about it's about it's like saying all these people mean well so but what's the actual what's the harm right. And so it gives like an eight a z of like how certain things from like from applied kinesiology to to vampires to an astral projection to even there goes far as health Feng Shui how that's ended up killing all harm to someone all the way down to Nigerian emails and stuff. It's quite interesting again I think it's not it's not a site that's been updated for a long while it's like a decade or something I mean they still got RSS to even do RSS anymore. And do do do do. So it's quite interesting you can go on and just see it has like stories of of what's happened or people that have been not here it goes very more business three year old murder by. Jesus well I've taken the show down a down a notch but yeah it's got all sorts of examples of where people kind of you know perhaps stopped doing certain medical things because they thought it was going to save them and then end up going bad or they had some sort of exorcism that went wrong. Very interesting stuff yeah. It's something you never thought you'd see you know like we had mumps and measles some of these diseases pretty much cured pretty much wiped out and then with so many people not trusting the vaccine. And it's also part of this like not being a part of society where it's like I need to protect my people I don't want to protect the greater group of people as they said recently vaccines saved maybe 20 million people in COVID according to scientific studies. So it's like it's about the greater group and you have to take some risk like because yes there's a 3% or 1% there's a very small chances that you have side effects from certain vaccines that does happen. But 97% protecting the greater good millions of people it's up to you but I'm just saying background check these people be more interested be more curious let's just not you know put the crown on the next guy that shows up. But we're running out of time. Dandy of a prediction or a story of the week this week. So a little surprise I gathered earlier that it's okay I think I've made some a lot more interesting than it is but I'm so I did I did one of those DNA test things which is quite good it was all good until my girlfriend's we had to go and Jeremy call and open the results on the object. More about it and the father is and the mother is but the craziest thing is that is that and this is genuine crazy maybe not you guys but I found it interesting I'm not even English I've got like I've literally got 0% English in me and I thought I was English I'm like mostly I'd be in North West European Italian Scandinavian and a bit of Jewish and also a bit of Middle East and West Asian. So yeah that was so that's why I'm renouncing the English and their stupid turning Bitcoin into a gambling thing and and taxing it anyway. Yeah so I'm it's what I have and I haven't done one myself but I've looked at the ones that my parents did so I think I have a generally good idea but one of the most interesting things about those tests is that they always expose that our genetic history is more complicated that were made up of more different people and that the very idea of like I'm not going to do it. So I think it's a very idea of like a plane a whiteness or a blackness or whatever really you're from you know this in the Middle East and this in the South and this in the North all of everybody is these kind of months with these you know multi-racial backgrounds this purity idea is completely wrong completely backwards has no actual truth in reality and the more people that do these tests as some people might be horrified they might be oh no I have this in my background. Yeah I think it's true about everybody and the same thing for the historical thing if you ever seen they do like like oh Ben Affleck you know who was your great great great grandfather and sadly if you're on the East coast or if you're in the South where I think it was a slave I think they were involved in the slave trade and these kind of aflex is just oh my god you know losing a thing but the same thing you check your DNA you check your history it's not always what you want. So I think I would say that like so we obviously we we got my my well as a family we've got it done so be my girlfriend and our two kids and and I'm more surprised that my kid results than I am my mind and so I'm proven as the father. Unfortunately I could be very surprising if they don't match at all. Yes they match at all. Unless she's got an inside of them. No but what's interesting is that it's not even a remote 50 50 I mean there's a huge difference they in some categories like the kids are more of a category way more as a percentage than I am. So you kind of think it really really oh my god for me so really like it's really interesting to get it done as a as a family. But yeah I was quite surprised the general groups of what I knew was was more teased like the main genetic groups. But yeah it was surprised to see that literally on the map I looked at it and there's like England's got no color on it whatsoever. It's all the rest of like Europe and like even like North Africa and and Western Asia. So well that was quite quite interesting. Yeah so I'm not even English anymore. Let's see what you already. The Maltees connection there is such a storied island so many people stopping through throughout the histories. It reminds me of the colonized. What in the most colonized places? It reminds me of the Sicilian speech from true romance but I'm not going to even touch that at all. You guys can go that up. It's classic. My story of the week is that I like many people on the internet and playing the new legend of Zelda tears of the kingdom. Having a pretty good time so far it feels a little bit like a sequel to the Zelda they came out with five years ago but it does seem to have stuff about the sky and the casms below. So the world of Zelda is getting bigger. The last Zelda was very much kind of Zelda plus Minecraft. You could craft different items together to make elixirs to make food. This one furthers that now I haven't been able to do it yet but you can make it says when you show the weapons it's like four sticks plus heavy rock equals hammer. And so that clearly there's recipes now on the weapons there's sky and casms to explore. There's kind of little gliders you can fly. There's little potential to build tanks perhaps. I've heard on the internet but yes just another great game in the Zelda series. I don't play that many video games anymore but when they release a Zelda game I try to you know set aside some time and play that thing. So if you're playing the Zelda say hi in the chat let me know how it's going for you maybe hit me up on Twitter doing pretty good got stuck a little bit really glad to be off of tutorial island. It was far too big and I was stuck there for far too long and I could see how some people would think maybe that's the whole game. But because it is a huge huge tutorial island with a lot of stuff to learn but if you played the last game. It's pretty much the same. Is it as good as the Ocarina of time. I don't know I didn't play I think that's a super Nintendo. I then 64 and yeah I missed out the two the two and 64 ones I have to play and the second one on the Wii or whatever was Twilight Princess or something I have to play that one. So I don't know I think it's as good as the last one which I was really impressed with the climbing is you can climb up stuff and then you can jump off with your hang glider. And you can fly all around the world that was really fun the one I liked last was the one on the game cube Zelda for sailing and it was all cel shaded animation and you would sail a boat everywhere. So it is interesting to see that it's always about transportation the new ways that you can get around. Yeah that was it like the the Ocarina of time I think was like the first game where you could ride a horse. It was pretty cool otherwise it took the game map was so massive it took hours to walk. So you like and the portal thing. See that's huge riding a horse is huge and even now I've been looking for some horses but haven't quite found them yet. I do kind of like the Zelda the link guy just running off into the nowhere you know you got a bag full of arrows and a sword and you just go out into the world. It is kind of fun just the exploring aspects of the game I think that's what I really like and then the puzzles and the puzzles get slowly harder they do a really good job of like giving you all the tools and then you're like oh maybe that'll work maybe that'll work. So I just got that thing I'll try that you know and and you use that to get through the puzzles I think that's what makes it such a great game. We talked about Zelda too much this is a Bitcoin show let's get back to work although I do have a Zelda Bitcoin connection about four or five years ago when I was still in San Francisco roast beef the legendary lightning developer was also playing Zelda and we were both crazy into it. So super fun at the time and I hope that he is enjoying the new Zelda as I imagine that he probably is not working on lightning working on the new Zelda. But thanks to everybody for joining us giving us a thumbs up and chatting in the chat down below send us a comment on the YouTube we'll be back again next week and until next time. Bye bye.