The Bitcoin Group, the American original, for over the last ten seconds, the sharpest Satoshi's, the best bitcoins, the hardest cryptocurrency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists, Martin Wishmare, from General Bites. Hello, Bitcoin! Dan Eave, the crypto raptor. Hey, everybody! And I'm Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network, moving on to issue one. Issue one. Bitcoin price jumps and recovers to $21,000. But the article changed. Oh well, Bitcoin jumps after a strong jobs report with the $21,000 mark in sight. The Fed is still a worry. Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have risen more than 3.5% in the last 24 hours to near $20,900, having traded previously, around $20,600. Ethereum rose at much to $16,000, $16,000. Hi, very close. Proposities in the future. Martin Wishmare, what do you think about the Bitcoin price rising, even though the jobs report was not what they wanted and stocks are still down? I'm not terribly impressed. This is like a blame for the radar. I think it's, you know, they can wake me up when there's a new all-time high. And until that happens, we'll just be building instead. Dan Eave, what about the price of Bitcoin? Well, I for one, over the moon, because I have broken my incorrect streak, which is like 12 weeks long now. So I think I went up last weekend. And so it seems to be gone up a little. But yeah, I'm with my team, price aside, like it's kind of, it's all cool when there's all time. We're all time highs. We're on that sort of sideways sort of motion. So, you know, the articles are generally, you know, 10% movement, you know, within a couple of weeks. And everyone's like freaking out or celebrating, but really, you know, until we're back at all-time heights, it's neither heat or there. But the cool thing is, is that more stuff, as you always say, is just being built every day. And more infrastructure being built. And more projects popping out. The woodwork, I just started using sat's back. I don't know if anyone started using it. I shifted from Quidco. And so, you know, I think cool sites like that help people get exposure to Bitcoin without actually, you know, putting money up front. Right? Because a lot of people don't want to risk, you know, buying in Bitcoin and then being disappointed if it goes down or whatever. But if you want to get into Bitcoin, just try and find a site like sat's back. And just carry on with your normal life shopping and throwing away your fear of money and get sat's back for it. So I think it's cool. Cool. It's like, yeah. And, yeah. I for one got almost one and a half million Satoshi spec already on sat back. So that's that's back.com. Make me Satoshi millionaire, you know, it's a douchey. Yeah. Well, one and a half million, but I saw somebody that already had like five million sat's back from from from shopping. So yeah, that's cool. I like that. And I was on why I signed up when it was 21.co like way before it was earn.com and then bought out by Coinbase. And that was just really cool because you got paid for, you got paid for basically saying no to ICO, shelling you. So like you don't open it up and it'd be like, would you like further information? But I'm a blind. You'd be like, no. And then it'd be like, you know, you get $2 in Bitcoin for this. So, you know, it was beautiful. It was just being paid to reject ICOs. But with this, yeah, at least you kind of, you know, you've got to shop anyway like a lot of people do online shopping. So get some cash back in Bitcoin and you're getting exposure to Bitcoin without putting, you know, putting your wallet up front. And I think it's a great way to kind of ease in. Well, I think we all think that the price is going to go back up before the Bitcoin happening and that it could even go beyond the previous all time highs, either after the happening or before the having depend on how the media interprets and explains to people what's going to happen. We as Bitcoiners, we know that the happening is going to happen that nothing can change it. It'll just vary from a couple of days when it actually happens. Everyone else will be, what do you mean they're reducing the production of Bitcoin by 50% 50% of the Bitcoin minds in the world are going to, you know, shut down theoretically, right? They're going to shut down. That's insane. So because of that, we all think the price is going to go up. It's the question of when it starts going up and if you're in the right position, when it goes up, everyone's trying to time the bottom was this the bottom. Will it go down again? Will there be another 18,000? Will you get that bottom? But it doesn't really matter. You're never really going to hit the bottom perfectly. That's why you should probably be dollar cost averaging. We'd get a little bit of this, a little bit of that by buying $100 a week or something like that. You'll get a variance of the bottom rather than trying to catch the actual bottom. Because then what if this was it? What if this was the bottom and people miss their chance to, you know, slide their money back in the market? Oh, I don't know. I think it's going to go lower. That's not going to be my prediction. But I do think, I don't know, man. I think, I think, you know, it's what we've 76% for more time. Why was kind of the peak of it? And it's usually around 80 to 85%. Right? So I don't know. I'm thinking, I'm thinking there's some short term sideways. Maybe a maybe even a little mini pump to 2426 and then, you know, down again, it's still two years. Nearly a year and a half at least till the next harbing. But what, you know, we've made a really good point about like them. And when the harbing happens, it's like half of the miners just shutting off. So you don't get all the bullshit about, you know, overproductive or conglomerates or whatever, like OPEC or whatever deciding to either increase production or decrease production. They literally can't do that. The miners can't do that. They, the maximum they will get is an average of 10, sorry, you know, a block every little 10 minutes. And you can't, you can't change that. And people aren't going to want you, you can, but it's slightly unlikely to be able to, that people will actually change it. And that's what's good about is this. Yeah, there's, there's no vote. There's no market conditions. It's not like if Bitcoin hits this or if this happens or if the jobs report is no good, we're going to do this. Yeah, it just happens on a schedule. And I don't think that the media has explained this to people enough. I think that there's a possibility this time of the reaction being different. If people realize what's happening beforehand, obviously there's a lot of very smart people running a lot of family offices and large banks and so forth, who are going to want to put their money back into Bitcoin to take advantage of this happening. Question is, when are they going to do it? Was this the time? Well, next time you the time, is it going to go to 18? Does it go to the 12 or the 10 that Dan keeps looking for? Or does it come back up? No one knows we're all going to find out that the only one who does know is the magical Bitcoin predictor ball that you'll now be predicting against our teen wish mayor. The price be higher or lower. It's time next week. I'm keeping a positive stride here. I think it's like it will be a bit higher, a bit higher. Don't expect any miracles yet, but a bit higher. Dan, Eve, is this positivity continuing? It is. And I think I think we are just going to take a little, little, little slight climb. Yeah, I think I think, especially that there's more articles circulating now about how Bitcoin's D decoupling from the rest of the market. So I think there's actually some real positive news articles from the mainstream ones, rather than just kind of, you know, it will be our environmental fight. So it's quite balanced at the moment. I think that's going to impact positively. I'm hearing a lot of a lot of waffling, but it comes out positive. We have an all positive panel. We're shaking the ball, which can't create bubbles, according to the Wikipedia. Will the price be higher this time next week? Reply hazy try again reply hazy try again. That's why the Bitcoin predictor ball is such an incredible source of predicting power because sometimes it refuses to predict, which is also a prediction. Moving on to issue two women will save Bitcoin. According to Tim Draper, legendary venture capitalist man who suggested that hotmail put a footer on every email they sent advertising hotmail and the genius buyer of the Silk Road bitcoins ending up with tons of Bitcoin while the United States gets no news Smithsonian museums. They could have kept the money and built the museums. Instead, they gave it to Tim Draper and Tim Draper says women could save Bitcoin. You've heard it before. He says that women control 80% of retail spending and they are only one out of six Bitcoin wallets. Dan Eve, why won't women use Bitcoin? Why? I've got no idea. Well, I'm not I think it's like this is always training on careful territory right because but but like I actually for my experience from shilling Bitcoin has always been that women have been far more receptive than men like by a long shot, you know, my getting my mom and my sister into Bitcoin. It was was a lot easier than my dad and likewise for other for other sort of other men like people who talked about it work for women more more interested. But they were more interested from a kind of theoretical level but wouldn't you know didn't actually sort of but didn't actually buy maybe that's slightly without I don't know because this problem right when we're getting into this. This is what you're doing you're going to generalize in some way so maybe women are slightly more cautious when it comes to you know their risk risk a bit more risk of us right. Whereas men do you know they're more likely to gamble and do crazy stuff and like you know like do jump out of a plane and all sorts of crazy weird things that that that that men do. That that that mean that they they die younger on average than women so maybe that kind of that that's part of the reason but ultimately. You know if as they pointed out in the article that women control 80% of retail spending then it seems like it you know it could be a good thing to get to get more women into into Bitcoin. Whether it's the you know the women will save Bitcoin is obviously a bit of a of a funny headline because Bitcoin you know let's be honest Bitcoin doesn't need saving whether it's from women or men or. Or non binaries or whatever like it doesn't it doesn't need saving it's a honey badger that that's relentless and resilience so you know they're they're having more women in the industries are always good it's not like it's not like a good experience going to a conference and and it just being full of sausage not there's wrong not there's anything wrong with sausage but it's nice having a bit of a mixture right. You know so I think it's a good thing to have more women in the industry whether that's coding whether that's contributing to to the infrastructure building we know products and anyways yeah it's good to have a bit of a bit of a variety. Well obviously this panel made up of three white men is going to solve the female in Bitcoin problem but I want to go ahead and throw myself right on that third rail that Dan was talking about and I want to put forth a theory I have no information backing this but I want to say what if women like spending money to get items where you always get an item but women don't like spending money to get risk whether it be gambling or stocks or Bitcoin. They don't like the uncertainty of that idea they would prefer to you know feather their nest to build their nest in a safe way whereas men as Dan was saying are outgoing and risking and betting the whole tribe and sometimes they fall off the cliff right sometimes they lose all their money in these disasters but they're not just doing it for the money they're also doing it for like the adrenaline for the kicks for the thrill of winning right and some women certainly have this some men don't have the love it and vice versa and so forth but if we're talking in generalizations I think they like spending it I don't think they like risking it. Artene what do you think am I totally out of line here. I think you have a point there that's uh yeah I didn't you know there's the numbers were a bit shocking the fact that only one in six Bitcoin wallets is owned by women is it's a bit old you know general bites we have a lot of women working in the office and not just like you know the side things but also like really like testing and stuff like that so so I never realized there is such a big gap in between I think this is also something that's probably very regional I think in the in check Republic and in Prague for example it's it's very much a healthy mix of men and women but yeah if you go to any any Bitcoin conference is usually more like a sausage fest I agree with them there. So yeah I thought I'm unfortunately I have access to our YouTube analytics as dismal and awful as they may be and our show here which I think is pretty general and down the line maybe a little boring sometimes but it's 95% men we are just drowning in sausage here so really talk about any intention or whatever it may be but as it is people are women no no offense men are not interested in this talking show so I don't know how we're going to get them interested in Bitcoin I was going to ask the classic exit question of you know what can we do or what kind of like oh if we had a discount on shopping or whatever but every answer that you give is pretty horrible so let's go back to and let's just predict future history here Dan give me a prediction when will women enter Bitcoin is it just a question of popularity if Bitcoin is ubiquitous and everywhere will women adopted at the same rate as men and that happens I don't know I mean one one thing I've yeah I think praise into it is whether it's society driven or or not that and Bitcoin and general tech has probably taken quite a long time for women to to get into partly because it was just seen as a really geeky dumb thing like you know that there's a stereotype of geeks and usually the geek is a man you know and it was kind of almost like a turning point where big bang theory made geekiness more of a you know between both sexes right and I think that and also you look at the a lot of the articles like loads of them especially from like is it advice something that they're always like they always have something that's like crypto bros or Bitcoin bros they genderize it and maybe that scares women off actually instead of making women more likely to get into Bitcoin they see these these articles that just go all the Bitcoin bros and the mupin macho men in in in you know an arrogance of Bitcoin blah blah blah and you know and they just think I don't want to be a kind of part of that that you know that I don't want to be involved in that because who wants to be around a bunch of Bitcoin bros you know I think that might be quite off putting rather than making people think well I can get into that industry and make a positive change so yeah I think that the the the historic limelight that Bitcoin's had has been one of like you know of not very you know not very much positivity around it and maybe that's also what what's as drawn you know women away more so the men in the you know if we look at yes it's face it crime rates men are kind of a bit more likely to to commit crime that women and when a lot of the articles are about how Bitcoin's used for these nefarious things and even you know using for evil rather than good that's probably put off a lot of women from getting into Bitcoin because they don't want to be a part of that kind of crypto bro illegal culture so but in the future I think it's you know we're seeing a lot more it a lot more balance in in conferences certainly go to them like now and actually there's a slight what that was it there was a pepe a pepe that I exhibition but went to literally a couple of days ago and and organized by by I don't know if he's still dock not doching himself or not but I'm not I'm fine so but yes but it was much more women there than I actually expected and and and and even some yet some the artists like Tasha moon does a stuff. There's more people than you'd expect at these events, especially I think they are the art based ones. So ultimately it's just going to balance out a bit more as time goes on. It's one of those things that initially gets a lot of bad press and probably does put women off more specifically because they're less likely to take risk and be involved in something that's nefarious and crazy. Well, on the other hand, I get daily emails, social media posts from gorgeous women that offer me to help me with my crypto portfolio management. So I've never met one, but I can't find me on social media and I say, you know, I could really help you build your portfolio and stuff. So I never really, I don't think they're real, but they're women though. The CGI women. I agree with Dan. I think the NFTs and crypto art are going to bring in a lot of women women that aren't interested in finance that aren't interested in crypto, bros or encryption or any of the difficult topics that we might have here. But I still, when we bring up crime and crime being a male dominated area, we go back again to this idea of risk. I think that women don't like risk. They don't want risk. They're less risky in crime. They're less risky in their romantic choices. They're less risky in their investment decisions. They like to play it cool. I don't think that there's anything technical stopping them from getting in anything in like an economic understanding. I think all this information is available online. It's open and free. It doesn't like turn off because you're a girl like the screen went away. The text is gone. No, text is available. Videos are there. Come on women and girls and everyone else. Let's all get into Bitcoin. I'm excited for everyone to join. But I just don't think it's happening till there is no risk. And then I think they'll adopt just like everyone else. I don't think there'll be any. There's no barriers where women can't understand crypto or anything. Martian, what do you think is it the geekiness or is it the risk that's scaring women off? I wouldn't know how to answer that. But yes, it could be partly the geekiness, I think. The risk, I don't know. I don't see it really as a risk. If you DCA your way into a nice Bitcoin stack, I don't consider that very risky. I think it's the geekiness. And on average, we've seen girls at our Bitcoin meetup and Amsterdam. And they even adopted a male nickname on the Telegram group because they didn't want to be bothered and bastard by geeks trying to whatever. So they even like, you know, Daniel is her name and she called herself Dan on the on the Telegram group. And it was only at the Bitcoin meetup that Dan turned out to be this beautiful blonde woman named Daniel. So I think, yeah, I think it's the geekiness and maybe the atmosphere is sometimes a bit hostile. I think, yeah. But I mean, that might be true at the meetups and impersonal gatherings as things. But once again, online, you can go to Coinbase. There's no troll box. Nobody's going to make fun of you if you want to buy Bitcoin or Litecoin or whatever you're into. And the same thing for all the the fact files, the frequently asked questions, the explainers, the videos like this and so forth. All the information is available to you. Please learn. Please make up your own mind and your own decision and invest at your own risk and so forth. The only thing is on the on the on the, you know, the idea of like hiding hiding in the agenda just because you would, you know, just be danics of Daniels that I've and maybe obviously this is just anecdotal. But there's not one Telegram group I've ever been in where a lady said something who's got a lady persona or whatever and someone's gone like, oh, woman's like, you know, like this, you know, it's almost like an, I don't know, like a 70s 80s view of like, if I, you know, I just haven't, I've never seen that. So it's a shame that people still feel feel that they have to pretend they're a guy to not want to get on because it's not something that I've ever witnessed. And so, and I've been in a lot of telegram groups with a lot of random different sort of thing. I'm not just telegram groups. So it's a shame that people do have to do that. But because, yeah, it's not really ever witnessed it. But like I said, it's an it's anecdotal. They could, they could be plenty of groups where someone's gone to say something and they've gone, oh, woman is speaking terrible. Know your limits. A lot, lots of people have been adopted pen names for other issues because they're old or they're young or where they live or what they look like or whatever. So there's lots of reasons for people to use another name. And if that makes you feel comfortable, no, welcome Dan to the show. Welcome, I mean, if it makes this, even if it makes this Dan, feel bad. I was going to say I think we should make it up. So I'm going to start identifying as Danielle now. And so that there will be one out of three of us will be female. I'll have to keep working on that. Everyone can check out worldcryptonetwork.com where we did used to have female guests in the past. And we'd love to have female guests in the future if you'd like to be on the show, send us an email or a tweet or something. Check out. We've got 3,013 videos. That's three months and 13 days, 17 hours. If you watched it consecutively, which is the best way to get caught up. Everyone does this. They all go back and they tell me I watched it three months long, three months, just on and on worldcryptonetwork.com forever and forever. Moving on to issue three, Morgan Stanley says a record number of Bitcoin have not been used for six months. Bitcoin is traded in the narrowest range since 2020, suggesting that our investors are holding on or hoveling on for higher prices. Artee and Wishmare, what do you think about this report that says that Bitcoin doesn't seem to move much anymore? Once people get a hold of it, they just seem to hold on to it. I was a little bit surprised. I didn't notice six-month holding is now a metric. I thought you'd have to at least keep it for a few years before it becomes a statistic. But now, no, no, no, you didn't touch it for six months. Are you a hotler? I was a bit surprised there because people they buy and they make my cell later in the year, six months, it's like nothing. If you hold your Bitcoin, hold it for at least four years, you'll see some appreciation there. I'm not sure what this statistic is supposed to mean. I think they just had a number and they decided to write an article about it. You do have to wonder about how many stocks are flipped over, though, or people selling their animals on stock like every three months. Amazon stock hasn't moved in six months because people like it and they're holding it. I don't know, I'm not sure about that. But it is fine, like Martin's saying, that old coins now means six months old. I myself made a historic NFT all the way back in 2017. That's just five years ago. I still remember doing it. It's that historic that long ago. Dan, Eve, what do you think about these old coins from six months? Oh, it's crazy. We've all been talking about an old Bitcoin, it's just my own, still hadn't moved. Not going to good only. Now it's good point, right? But then it's just a metric, right? It's a metric that people are probably trying to use that just shows that investors aren't just willing to dump their coins. But this is more importantly, they probably, as most of the banks that have adopted the ability or allow the ability to buy Bitcoin for their clients, they're probably only over a certain amount of net worth or whatever, or some sort of service that goes out to certain customers. So they're probably less likely to be selling because they've got more general cash anyway. They've got more surplus cash than the average show that bought Bitcoin and or Jane average Jane that bought Bitcoin that needs to sell it to to live and to pay bills, etc. So I think it's a slightly skewed metric and it's only relevant to say the tier of Morgan Stanley customers that are actually allowed to buy Bitcoin. But it is a good indicator anyway in terms of, if it was applied to the whole blockchain of how much people are holding onto Bitcoin. Yeah, so it's just one of these metrics that's, you know, it's a base basic indicator in its current form with an isolated group. But I think it's a much more interesting thing to look at the whole chain and how slow Bitcoin is moving. And there's been other analytics that show like, you know, the one year plus holdings and moving of Bitcoin has been increasing year one year. So I think that's kind of really positive news overall. I do think it's funny too that they use this reference to authority that Morgan Stanley, the famous banking company tells us that the Bitcoins have not moved. Well, you know who else tells us that the publicly available blockchain, you could run your own report on the blockchain, figure out what Bitcoins haven't moved and publish it yourself and be just as factually correct as the amazing, you know, investigative prowess of Morgan Stanley, the investor insight, all the people they have working on this. So I think that's great that they've worked on that. And then I want to go to the exit question, advice for holders, even if we've said it before, what's your best advice for holders? Maybe something that people haven't thought of like I know in the old days if you had not spending money, you take your credit card, you'd freeze it in a block of ice and you'd put it in the freezer. And that way you couldn't spend your money. Martine, what should people do to hold their Bitcoins other than by leaving them on an exchange, of course? Well, the first step is to get yourself a wallet. My personal choice will be a treasurer, but others like to use ledger or gold cards or whatever Bitcoin wallet you select, make sure it's from a well-known brand, order it at the original manufacturer, don't order it from third party for security reasons, learn how to now play around with it, wipe it, then restore it again, do that a few times so you feel comfortable and then take your coins off the exchange. This is really, really, even as poor as just as important as buying the Bitcoin, is taking them off the exchange because until you do so, you don't actually own the Bitcoin, only after you have them in your wallet, then you own the Bitcoin. Otherwise, you just have a claim on some Bitcoin in your name, which will not really work out very well if the exchange goes bust. Other than that, it doesn't matter what you need to do, just keep that Bitcoin wallet and those recovery seats, private, don't share them with anybody, don't share you over, don't get over excited to tell everybody that you own Bitcoin, this is another security thing, and then look again at your wallet in play a year or four. I personally like to monitor my stack with some software, I'm not going to advertise around software, but it is, I think, important to do some basic accounting, even if it's just for tax purposes because you probably will have to pay a little bit of tax once you sell them again and realize your profit, but other than that, there's not much to do it, but keep them off the exchange, don't leave your coins on the exchange, that is a stupid thing you can do, and believe me, I've been there, I lost 80% of all my Bitcoins over the years. Another nice thing about taking your coins off the exchange is it will stop you from selling them, or at least it'll make it a little bit harder. So if you see the price drops suddenly and you lose all faith in Bitcoin and need to sell, well, you have to go find your treasurer, you got to put it in, you got to do the codes, you got to send the money, got to wait for it to be sent, and maybe by then you'll have come to your senses and you only want to sell like 10% of your Bitcoin or 30% instead of all of it or none of it or all of it or none of it, and that would go into my second piece of advice, which is stop looking at the price. Welcome to Bitcoin, you're a brand new Bitcoiner, as mad Bitcoin said to you almost 10 years ago, what are you going to do now? Check the price every five minutes, check the price, check the price, I've got to widget on my phone, it tells me the price, the price went up, the price went down, the price went up, you're driving yourself crazy, and next you're going to start looking for gurus, like the magic Bitcoin eight ball that can predict the price for you, and you're going to just trust the guru, you're like, I got to get more advice from the guru, when's the guru show on, I need the guru, so don't look at the price, don't invest more money than you can afford to lose, dollar cost average, 10 bucks a week, 100 bucks a month, whatever it is, comfortable for you, and don't look at it. Come back in five years, be happy, be surprised, or come back in five years, and we were completely wrong, Bitcoin's terrible idea. Either way, you checking the price, and selling and rebying every 20 minutes is not going to work out in the long run. Not financial advice, do whatever you want, blah, blah, blah, but we've been in a long time, and like Margeen said, nobody plays it correct as well. I also want to give you permission to screw up. We all screwed up, we all sold, we should have bought, we all bought, we should have sold, we bought things in Bitcoin that are worthless now. I swear I have this wind chime, I think it's a point one, it might be a point three, I don't want to think about it, it's like a wooden chime. Do you still have your Apalka socks? Because those were the only thing you could buy with Bitcoin back in the days, really itchy Apalka socks. And I think that the company that was selling those made off like bandits, they were geniuses if they held. But Dan, what's your advice to holders, to hotlers, what should the Bitcoiners do? Yeah, I like what you said, just ignore price because you just get caught up in, I mean, it obviously when everything starts to get hyped up and there's near all time high, then everyone's bouncing off the walls and you can't avoid Bitcoin twice. But again, my sense is keep your Bitcoin off exchanges, use a hardware wallet where possible. I think the cool thing with Trezor supports, so I like Trezor and Ledger obviously, they're industry-leading ones. Trezor's all open source, where it's ledger isn't. Trezor supports Shemeer secrets, which is where you can have like, almost like a multi-six, a bad word, but you like like three or five of the actual secrets that you can use to restore the key. Also, I like the way that Trezor implemented the additional 13th word or 25th word on top, with Ledger, when you're actually using the Ledger, you can only have one separate pin that allows you to get in at each time, whereas when you plug the Ledger in, you could have a different word for asking which word you like to add in. And it's a lot easier to see and access those different secrets. So I think that's probably better. Also, I mean, for me, the hardest thing is setting up the seat, because every time I do it, if I've moved, I write the words down, then I'm like, what if my phone camera accidentally went over the words? So then I'll move to a different room where I'll wipe a computer and there's a massive technique to doing it so that your op-sec is completely free of the roof. If you really want to go to the end for the degree, you just split your seat into two and then store two halves in four different banks just in case one of the banks got you the banking bolts, that sort of thing. But ultimately, you've got to apply a level of security that's probably going to match your assets that you have on it. So no one wants to lose money, but there's no point in anxious about storing your seat if you're only going to store like $100 a bit going on it. Obviously, you still got to secure it, but I don't know. There's lots to read up on it, because everyone's dead. I think that goes into my other point, which is you can always buy two treasures. You could buy three treasures. You could buy two safe deposit box. You could buy two safe for your house. You can split up your money thanks to the power of Bitcoin into many walls. You could either do an exact copy of your money so that if someone steals one, you could go get the copy or you could even just break it up to like 0.1s or 0.01 or whatever. Just in case you lose everything else, you'll be like, I've still got that treasure that I buried under the house or whatever it may be. You have options. And this is something you might not think of originally because you're like, oh, I got one treasure. It was expensive. I put all my money in there. And then if you look at your money now and you're like, this money is worth two treasures. You know, this money is worth two or three treasures. There's a lot of money. You can do that. And I'm just putting that idea out into people's heads. And then I also wanted to say that I think the best price chart for you to look at is whatever people tell you about Bitcoin. So if you meet somebody on the street and they're like, oh, I heard that Bitcoin went up a lot. That's when you have learned that it's gone up. If you meet them on the street and they're like, oh, it's gone down. And you see the newspaper headlines and you're like, oh, it's down. That's the way to do it. Because yeah, whenever your buddy from high school or college calls you up and they're like, hey, I heard you're into the Bitcoin. It's doing well. That's a great time to sell. And whenever they they tell you that it's gone really bad, they're like, hey, I heard you're into Bitcoin. You lost all your money. That's the time to buy. So you have these, we all already have them in our lives. These people that will tell you the right thing. Just like when Paris Hilton got into NFTs or when Paris Hilton got into Bitcoin. But it's harder to listen to those signs. So again, I would also say one more idea is you could listen like 20%. You could be like, hey, you know, Bitcoin's at the bottom. I'm going to throw 20%. See if that's right or Bitcoin's at the top. I'm going to sell 20%. See if that's right or 10% or 5%. You can taste it. You don't all or nothing, all or nothing. You have options. But we're running. I just can say one thing with setting up a hardware, well, I'd recommend is because I've heard a few horror stories along the way. But when you do, when you initially you know, record your seed, before you you hide it away forever, wipe the device and then put the seed in again and make sure that you've got like the same address just in case, because I've heard people that have not either not written the seed down properly or they've written the wrong seed somehow. So like the best thing to do, wipe it as Martin said, just think you're comfortable with that process, wipe it and then put that seed in again and just make sure that that address that you're going to be sending your dollar cost averaging to is the address that you do own and you have recorded correctly. Because there's nothing there nothing there'd be nothing worse than going back to your life savings in 20 years and realizing that you wrote out of that dark instead of dick. Well, maybe that's probably not words, but you know, that's just an example. Or if you wipe off the little sheet and the ink goes away like Dan had happened to him because it's a plastic card that you're writing on. Make sure you're writing on a proper piece of paper with a proper pen and so forth, something that you think's going to last. Other people have used those register receipts from a thermal printer and you put that through a laminating machine and now you'll never see your thermal printed receipt again because it turned black. So a lot of that kind of stuff happens with actual money on it, horrifying amounts that would terrify you now as a new user, but that was the way of the world. So we can learn from other people's mistakes and try to do better the next time. Moving on to issue four issue four Satoshi anonymous as Edward Snowden said recently on Twitter 14 years ago today, yet Satoshi remains anonymous remarkable. And I just wanted to, you know, take a topic here and celebrate the anonymity of Satoshi how impossible it seems or sounds that someone has written such a monumentous paper as the white paper someone has published amazing software like the Bitcoin software. And yet nobody has come for and say, Hey, Satoshi's my cousin. Hey, I worked with Satoshi. Hey, Satoshi, no one with a credible theory at least many posters and pretenders, but we all know in the truth Satoshi has not been found. Dan, what do you think about Satoshi's incredible anonymity truly unmatched in history? People have written books anonymous. They usually come out within three or four years to last 10 years is amazing, but 14 and still going with the entire media just desperate to find out who is Satoshi Nakamoto. Well, it's the sort of thing that I just think that we don't need to know. Because it would whatever happens, whoever it ends up being, I don't actually think there's many reasons or many positive ways it could be spun. I mean, who it is on earth? It's going to be, it's going to polarise. And so it's just better that we don't actually ever know. And that I think that it's, and it's really just poetic the way it happened. It was, you know, he just disappeared off into the sunset. And no one's heard from him since. So I think that's the way the way it needed to be. Because that person becomes a vitality. They become an idol for this living idol that could do something or say something stupid politically. And then Bitcoin dumps because of it or pumps because of it. And Bitcoin doesn't need that. It needs to be just this independent thing. The ball was thrown in the air and now the world is keeping the ball up. We don't need to know who threw the ball in the air other than know that it's a pseudonym and that they did a really cool thing. And and the concepts, the reasons behind it. The fact that the white paper was born on like was Halloween is quite interesting. Whether that was a, you know, whether that was done on purpose or not. I don't think there's ever been any reference to tie it down to specifically to Halloween or it was just an arbitrary date that was released. But you know, Satoshi from the chat rooms and stuff that it was like, you know, obviously, Satoshi is a Japanese name. But the the the the genesis block was equated the times, which is an English newspaper used, didn't use proton, but like the German proton, like if I'm writing, you use a German proton email or something like that. So it's kind of a bit of a mix up of like a patchwork of of the world. And it just needs to kind of stay that way. But one thing I know is there's definitely not great right. No, it's not Greg rides. He's baked our shiit. And like Dan says, we have a patchwork of clues, but we don't even really have a solid lead where we're like, oh, Satoshi was definitely at this internet cafe in Japan on the 30th or that he was in London on the 12th. We don't have any real solid information to go to for Satoshi. We have things like they analyze, they analyze his sentence structure. And they say what words he use often and how he puts two spaces after his periods, which means he must free from a typewriter generation like myself, an old bastard that learned how to type not even on a computer. So but still to create such a thing presumably to profit from such a thing. If he had any early coins that aren't the Satoshi coins, which seems pretty obvious, he'd have tons to not mention it, to not brag about it, to not tell a woman to tell a lover to have a major divorce, to have family members get upset. You have, for example, the unibomber. They sure they they ID his typewriter, but at the same time they really caught him because his family member, his brother said, hey, that sounds like the crazy stuff my brother says he lives in a cabin in the woods. He's bombing people. That's unacceptable. Martín Wishmeyer, no one has ratted Satoshi out despite the amazing money you could get from the media, the money you could get from blackmailing him, the money you could get from having early Bitcoin. No Satoshi. Personally, I think Satoshi looked at what came before Bitcoin and well, with many different forms of digital cash before that, but fairly recent before Bitcoin was a liberty reserve and e-gold. And in both cases, the founders of those networks, well, it didn't end well. So I think that was like a lesson for Satoshi to never ever reveal his identity. And I think it was good. And on many of those altcoins you see nowadays, they have a CEO, a founder, a marketing team, a community manager, and stuff like that. But Bitcoin doesn't need that. Bitcoin survives on his own. And I think this is one of the reasons why Bitcoin is far superior to all the other coins. And Martín, I think the failure of e-gold and liberty reserve also kind of taught people to distrust new coin projects. When Bitcoin comes along, it's released on Halloween. There's a paper kind of looking at it for a couple of months and all of a sudden the software pops out. It's got a really goofy name. It was the failure with the previous system. So it said there was centralized. And e-gold was all good and well and was backed by gold and all. But once the gold was rated by, I don't know, FBI or whoever rated it, government institution, the value of e-gold was basically like gone. So that was a big lesson too for the first Satoshi Nakamoto to make it decentralized. But when you make it decentralized, you make it appear to appear. How are you going to issue the cash? So I think he did a brilliant job there. And sometimes you wonder, yes, I wish I known who Satoshi was, but as Dan said, it doesn't really matter anymore. It's there. And of course, historically, historically, we all know the story of Prometheus who brought fire to man and then was punished by being strapped to a rock and having his liver eaten every day. And then his liver would grow back and then the bird would come back and eat it again. So I'm sure Satoshi kept that in mind when deciding to stay anonymous. However, now it's time for the exit question where you will predict the future. Tell me the story, Dan. Does Satoshi Nakamoto ever reveal himself or herself or the alien self? Does it happen on their deathbed? Are they revealed 20 years, 30 years, 40 years down the line? Do they write some kind of paper and hide it underneath a house or in a vault that's one day discovered? Do we ever learn who Satoshi is? Yeah, if we did, it would have to be via Satoshi himself because there's enough people that are drawn through every fraction of evidence that you could guess who Satoshi was. We would have realized by now we're nearly 14 years on since the Genesis box. And for what, we are 14 years since the white paper. So I think we would have known by now. There's been interesting articles have read in the past about how certain government agencies have got way more of an idea than anyone else because of the access to the information that they have. But as a general person, you just simply don't have access to the same data that someone in the government that can write a, what's the word, write a, some sort of freedom of information, act of question. Information, act. But even more so than that, more from a, you know, like a warring, essentially a warring, right? A data warring. So I think that the governments are more likely to have that information, but it seems well enough dispersed now in the way Satoshi went around hiding his identity that no one's, I don't think we're ever find out. So it would have to be on on the deathbed. And even so, I don't know, I think the principle of, you know, to be silent for so long already. And you know, I think there's a, I don't know, I just can't see, I can't see him doing it. I can't see it happening. And I don't want to. I don't, I don't, I think I just like the fact that it's a mystery, you know, it's that made the mysteriousness of it, it sells it more for me than if I was to find out who it was. And I think they know that, they know that they came out of the Satoshi closet. It would change the ballgame completely. And you don't, you don't want that. I think in Bitcoin doesn't want any, it doesn't need it. Of course, I'm reminded of one of my favorite movies, Wag the Dog, where Dustin Hoffman says, over and over again, if you're the producer, nobody knows what you do. You get the credit, you get the credit. How could this Satoshi person not want the credit? How could you not want it now? How could you not want it in 20 years if this is truly a monetary revolution like we all think it's going to be? How could they not want the credit? It's an amazing story. It's an amazing amount of control. A martine, what do you think will Satoshi be outed by family and friends? Will Satoshi reveal themselves on the deathbed? Or will we never know Satoshi is? I don't think we'll ever know. I think there is personally, I think Satoshi is probably no longer alive. But yeah, we'll never know. All right, bonus exit question in case it comes out next week, who Satoshi is? Who are our usual suspects? Who are the names we're going to throw into this ring? Good or bad that we've heard? Obviously, I'll start Nick Scabbo. A lot of people talked about that early on. They had this linguistic analysis where they used the same sentence structure, the same words. Adam back, friend of the show, incredible programmer. Scabbo was not mentioned in the white paper. He didn't link to the article. So maybe he's trying to cover it up. Adam back, invented proof of work. He's in the right place at the right time. Has all the right knowledge. How finny, big early programmer, contributor to Bitcoin, maybe talking to himself the whole time. The Sassimmon? Sassimmon? Sassimmon? Len Sassimmon or something like that? Was the other. Remember him? That was the other. The other. The other. The other. The other. The contributor. Kind of anonymous. They have his name though. They have like an alias for him. The number three guy. Could be him. Dan. Who else you got? Well, it's BTC moon guys. John Nash. John Nash is an excellent solution. Ben is always saying that. Early cryptographer had all the kind of knowledge of beautiful mind, the Russell Crowe film. Very, very possible. John Nash. What's the joy? Eto? I've heard thrown around very smart MIT computer scientist. I think Adam back told me that one. If you want to put it in the record. But again, we don't know. I don't think Adam knows unless Adam Satoshi so on and so forth. I don't have any. But he never reckons himself in the white paper. He wouldn't have referenced himself. You know, it's the other side of the scaboo coin, right? Where you're like, you're either not referencing yourself on purpose or you're being super cheeky and you're referencing yourself because who would reference themselves? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. A double blood thing. So I don't think we know. I don't think the chat knows. I think it's like Dan said, it's a great mystery. It helps sell Bitcoin. Certainly when you get in, you're like, I'm going to find out. I'm going to read all the right articles. I'm going to figure this mystery out. But at the end of it, you just come back with more mystery. What I was sorry is because at one point that I did see it, I think it was a, I'm trying to find the comment on the on the snowden post. It was when I was looking through it. But there were some pretenders, I think, on the snowden post. There was some like a lot of discussion of somebody who claims to be Satoshi, but doesn't seem to provide any proof. That doesn't seem to interest me. Yeah. Oh, no. Well, I was thinking, well, I actually hate you. So it's fun to be enough. Actually, the comment I'm going to see here is, sorry, but crypto bros have murdered any possibility of this ever becoming a thing. So I love the classic crypto bros. People have got people hate bros, don't they? But the comment was the fact that the government's will have control via CDBCs. So I'm still kind of thinking that there's this conspiracy theory that it was invented by government to get something that's loved by anarchists, the idea that it is completely decentralized and to let that spread, but then to make it more acceptable to have a CDBC to see BDC. And also just the other theory of like the US creating it because it's a hedge against the the waning power of the dollar being used as the kind of the world's currency. So you know, once it finally proliferates around the world, you know, the CIA could turn around and be like, ah, now that everyone's using Bitcoin, we've got a million of it because we are Satoshi. Something crazy like that, you know, can then they build more Smithsonian museums. And then they build more Smithsonian's exactly, but now it was all worse that mad bitcoins was in on the plot the whole time. Yeah. I do love the CIA conspiracy theory option. I do think we have to consider it. Somebody has those Satoshi coins. And if it is the CIA or the US government, it would be an incredible reveal. And what a what a like beautiful con like Dan is saying to have all these anarchists and libertarians and me see people and economic people all out there supporting your coin. And at the end of the day, you're like, we the US government are just so clever that we invented an alternative currency, just in case our currency, which is number one, and that we back up with more ships ever falters. They'd have to be very clever. Right. And then they sell everything to Tindraper. Yeah. Well, they tricked him because they have millions more. They can crash the market and pull those right back. They're very powerful in these scenarios, but it'll make a lot of great movies and a lot of great stories and a lot of great stuff that I hope to read in the future about who is Satoshi. So I look forward to that. But we're running out of time. Our teen wish mayor prediction or story of the week. Go ahead. Story of the week. So yeah, I should have thought about this, but yeah, we're going to the LA big comp. And so we're pretending to of pretending pre pretending working on getting everything sorted. So yes, I believe last week we had a coupon code. So if if any of you is in the area, I think it will be primarily Spanish speakers, Spanish language speaking big coiners, though, which is unfortunate. I don't speak any Spanish yet. It's the second largest language in crypto. So maybe at one point I'll have to learn Spanish, but my colleagues will there. So we'll be there. So if you're if you're coming over, do join us. Another nice new feature is that we created a new product like its conversion kit, which will convert another brand Bitcoin ATM very popular by Jen mega. It's a kiosk machine. They have stopped creating new features for this model ATM. So clients of us asked us if we could build a conversion kit. So we did and we launched it while this week at a small box with the ATM operating system on it, you connect all your peripherals in the ATM. And then you can turn your aging old Jen, Jen mega kiosk, you can turn it into a brand new general by the ATM. And you can use all the features, all the benefits, automated accounting, everything. So yes, I hope it will become a big success. It probably means we will sell less ATM in the future because people can convert any of the existing ATM to new standard. But I think it's good. We are helping many of the clients that are left in the dark. We are helping them out with a new OS for their aging Bitcoin ATM. So with a little bit of luck, you'll be seeing new general by its ATM pop up in different form factors. So yeah, that was my story of the week. That's a very cool idea to let them continue to use their ATMs and to get new software, especially when the original company no longer exists. Also, Martin, to necessitas a blare espaniol es muy bueno. That's good. See, do a lingo. You can learn all the languages. Dan, Eve, a prediction or a story of the week. Go ahead. A story of the week's got to be the awesome Pepe art event in London. It was really cool. It was a great turnout and I had a bit of a sing song along with Roger, Roger 9000 was there as well. So he also performed. And if you haven't checked out Roger 9000, he's got some incredible like that. I've still been the best like visuals I've seen in Bitcoin songs. He's got really amazing music and he performed. That was really cool. And yeah, I bought a hat. I bought this hat. Amazing. It's got the Pepe and like Squashface Pepe. And then I also bought a piece for the ward as well. It wasn't in the auction but I saw it on the wall and I had to have it so I bought it. But I didn't take it home with me because I was drunk and as you do, Bitcoin conferences. But apart from that, it was really cool. Yeah, so you've got to go to these Bitcoin art events are incredible because there's just so much creativity in Bitcoin and it's just a really cool thing to go and see. And it's so exciting to chat about crypto art and Bitcoin art to people. So yeah, I think get yourself to Bitcoin art event and check it out. Also check out web 3 web 3 WCN zone CEO is there as well. Obviously is the auction here doing a great job. And yeah, so that was cool. Very cool for Theo and for Rare Pepe is good to see people celebrating Rare Pepe is there a classic blockchain collectible. But we're running out of time. Thanks to everybody in the chat for chatting during the show. Be sure to give us a thumbs up and a comment down below. Push subscribe if you haven't already. And until next time.